300 grain bullet mold for the 45-60

[curdog]

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Does anyone have a mold that drop 300 grain bullets and works well with black powder. I have a Lyman 457190 and it doesn't do well with BP. Has anyone out there tried the Buffalo Arms mold. They say it is the same as the Lyman but was wondering if it has wider grease grooves. I have thought about getting one custom made like the RCBS 45-325 that would drop bullets at 300 grs with 16 to 1 alloy. Has anyone delt with Old West Bullet Mould befor? I want one with a plain base or I would probably get the RCBS that is made for gas checks. I don't have a need for gas checks and don't want the extra expence.

[Buck Stinson]

I don't know about the Lyman 457190, but I have a 300 grain Lyman 457191 that I've used for over 40 years.  It's a great blackpowder bullet and has worked perfectly in many of my original guns for such calibers as .45-60, .45-70, .45-85 and .45-90.  All of these calibers used this 300 grain bullet in factory ammo.  This mold is still listed on the Lyman mold chart.

Adios,
Buck

[curdog]

Buck I goofed. I ment 457191, I was thinking of my 45LC mold. I loaded five rounds with the Lyman bullet wiyh 62 grs. of Goex Express ffg. I couldn't hit a 8-1/2"x 11" sheet of paper at 50 yards. And two out of the five tumbled on me and struck the backstop sideways. My RCBS bullets that are 350 grains work well with the black powder. My Lyman works well with smokeless, five shots less than 1-1/2" at 64 paces. My mold has a bevel base does yours? Maybe that has something to do with it.

[Buck Stinson]

My Lyman mold does have the beveled base.  They patterned their molds after the Winchester molds of the day, which all cast a beveled base bullet.  There are only two reasons a bullet will keyhole.  Either the barrel has a bad bore, or the bullet diameter is too small for the bore size.  You've got to match the bullet to bore diameter when shooting black powder.  It may have an oversize bore and the mold won't cast a bullet large enough.  You also mentioned that you are shooting 62 grains of FF Express.  If I read your post correctly, you're shooting a .45-60 right?  With 62 grains of Express, you're probably pushing the bullet too fast.  If you continue to use the Express powder, drop your charge to 55 grains, use a card wade and correct any problems you might have with bullet versus bore diameter.  See what happens.  Let us know.

Adios,
Buck

[curdog]

Buck I don't have a micrometer. But I checked my bullets with my calipers the lyman bullet drops out at .458 and the RCBS drops out at least at .459. I use a .459 sizer when lubing the bullets. I drove a bullet through the barrel and it came out at .456.  I may get a mic so I get a more accurate reading but I'm sure my bullets aren't undersized for the bore. I'm also sure the bore is in good shape its new and shiney. I'm wondering if the fouling isn't the problem. My RCBS bullets have larger grease grooves than the Lyman. I'll try wiping the bore more often and see if that helps.

[Buck Stinson]

If your bore is .456 and you run your bullets through a .459 sizing die, you may be shooting too far over bore size.   The first thing to do is make sure of bore size.  You can only do this by using a very soft pure lead bullet or .50 caliber round ball.  The largest part of a rifle bore is usually in the middle of the barrel.  Your bullet must be hammered in the bore to expand at the largest area within the barrel.  Winchesters are hard to do, because you can't work from the breech end of the barrel.   Once you find the true bore size, try sizing the bullets at that size.   Your 16 to 1 lead/tin should be hard enough to work very well in a new bore.   I would still cut down on the powder charge and use a card wade.  Are you sure you don't have a burr at the muzzle crown?  If the crown is off, then that will also create a big problem with accuracy.  I think we can get this thing to shootin yet.  I'm taking off tomorrow morning for the Winchester show in Cody and will not be able to get back to you for several days.  Do leave posts and let me know how it's working out.  Good luck.

Adios,
Buck

[curdog]

Can't be a crown problem shoots to good with smokeless and the RCBS mold bullets. I can get 1-1/2" groups at about 60 yards with smokeless and the 300 grain Lyman. I get about 2-1/2" at 50 yards with BP and the RCBS mold bullets. Just couldn't get the Lyman bullet and BP to work. I did use a card wad with the RCBS and not with the Lyman. I don't know if that would cause more fouling or not. I'm used to shooting BP in muzzleloaders but no experiance with cartridge and BP.