Montana Peak Hat??

[Shotgun Steve]

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Howdy Folks,
I was wondering if anyone had a website that could document the Montana Peak style hat?
I have been looking and I have found various references to it being popular in the old west.
I have had the Time-Life series of old west books since they came out. There are several pictures of the peak in them but unfortunately there are no dates. Can you good folks point me in the right direction so I can finish my research? I thank you in advance.

Shotgun Steve

[Fox Creek Kid]

Oh boy, here we go. 

[Books OToole]

The general concensus is that the 'Montana Peak' becomes popular in the 1880s.  They show up in a lot of Charlie Russell paintings.

The earliest documentation that I have found is on page 15 of Picture Gallery Pioneers by Ralph W. Anderews.  It is a photograph of "Members Engineering Department U.S. Geological Expedition of the 40th Parallel" taken in 1869, by T.H. O'Sulilivan. The fourth man from the left appears to be wearing a Montana Peaked hat. 

There are a lot of neat hats in the picture.  One great "roper curl" w/o any crease.

Books

[Delmonico]

Stetson added it to the factory line sometime in the 90"s, my refeance book for that is at work.

[RRio]

Found this thread about 1883 campaign hats, although some of the pictures appear to have Kragg-Jorgenson rifles which would date the pics to 1890s.

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?p=153134

[French Jack]

I saw quite a few trapdoor Springfields, was unable to positively ID a Krag, but there may be some of the Winchester Hotchkiss bolt actions in the bunch.  They were adopted before the Krag.

[St. George]

There are two 'Montana' variants.

The 'Montana Pinch' - with three indentations - and the 'Montana Peak' - with four, and most commonly seen as a 'Smokey Bear' hat.

The 'Montana Pinch' seems to start showing up in the late 1880's, and for some reason - became 'very' popular, since it shows up in photos from all over the country, but moreso as the turn of the century approached.

Great-Grandpa must've been a slave to fashion...

The Army adopted it in 1911, and different Branches would put their own spin on the shape - with Cavalry  adjusting the  brim to curve gently upward - fore and aft, and Infantry wearing it dead flat, or with the front slightly turned down.

My Dad was a pre-WWII NCO - still being issued the Campaign Hats of the Great War - and in winter, they'd pile snow on the brim and place the hats near the space heaters, so they'd dry flat - then, they'd stiffen them with sugar water.

They weren't 5X Beaver, by any means - more like Big, Honkin' Norway Rat...

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

[Delmonico]

Terry seems to have sold the Stetson book that had the date that Stetson added this to the factory styles.

[Ottawa Creek Bill]

Steve,

On page 234 of the Sears 1897 catalog I have, there are two Montana Peak Hats. One is listed at $3.00 the other is $5.25. The first hat called the "Pine Ridge" is a low crown, the other, the "Texan Chief" has a 6 1/2 inch high crown. So, they were around at least in 1897. They are both listed as Sombreros or Mexican Sombreros(?).

I have a copy of the 1895 Montgomery Ward catalog and a copy of Bloomingdales 1886 catalog. I'll look them up and see what they show. If you would like I can scan the pages and post them here tomorrow.

St. George was right about what they were made of, they were Nutria Fur...basically a big south american Rat.

Bill

[Will Ketchum]

Bill, if memory serves me correct Bloomingdales has very few men's hats and no Western style.

In the Montgomery Wards catalog there are several hats under cowboy hats but they are all open crown.

The 2 you mention in the Sears catalog are the ones that always come to my mind when people speak of Montana Peaks.

Will Ketchum

[Ottawa Creek Bill]

Steve,

Here ya go...Lower left...Upper right. i left this image large so you would be able to read the print.

Will,
You're right about the other two catalogs not having any Montana Peak style hats....what that means I don't know except they may have come later then 1895 as a store bought hat...you all will have to draw your own conclusions....

Bill

Click your right mouse key to "view image' to enlarge the image:

[Shotgun Steve]

 Thank you for posting that information Bill I appreciate it. I thank all you other fellas as well.
The information will be most helpful. I am sticking with the Boss of the plains hat to be safe in forming my persona but I do like the Peak. I have a couple and one of them is made of that miserable rat nutria.. .. take care pards.

 Shotgun Steve

[Halfway Creek Charlie]

Nutria!
Them's Cajun swamp rats. they taste pretty good all cooked up Cajun style.

[River City John]

The state of Maryland just gave the green light to hunters to begin a massive kill-off of the critters in the hopes to save the loss of coastal grasses that help anchor the inland shores and wetlands from erosion.

The new state motto will be "The only good nutria is a dead nutria."

[Delmonico]

A nutria rather than the repoeted "rabbit" is what tried to get Jimmy Carter on his famous bayou trip.  Just sic the Secret Service on them.

[French Jack]

Shades of James Cagney: "Take that!  You lousy rat!"

[Marshal Deadwood]

That one hat,,,I cant see so well this morn,,,sure seems to have the 'Gus' crown guys ?

I know,,I know,,the 'Gus' is hollywood,,,but,,take a look at that one hat on the right,,,the crown,,,sure looks 'Gus'...

however,,,im going with one of three that are more,,'accurate' ,,,becuase,,even IF the Gus could be right,,and aint saying it is,,,,but ,,its percieved that its not,,,

I am leaning toward that 'Hickok' hat now,,,,,looks like it was an 'old time favorite' by the adverstisment in the catalogue.

Marshal Deadwood  *who is just musing this morning

[Ottawa Creek Bill]

Mike,
Are you talking about the "Sportsman"? It looks more like the standard cavalry crease of the time then it does the one associated with Robert Duvall in Lonesome Dove, one of my all time favorite westerns....doesn't have the slope in the front.

Bill

[Marshal Deadwood]

Yes I see what your sayin' Bill,,,,

any you boys every got a River Junction hat sloppin' wet ? and how did it hold up ? dry out and retain its form farily good?  the fur good 'nuff that it springs back when crushed ?   ,, cause dem elements and Murphys Law are sure to get to me at some point,,

is his fur blend, rat fur ?  rabbit ?  prob not beaver is it ?

Marshal Deadwood  *who is big time ponderin' that 'Hickok',,,

[French Jack]

I believe that Jim Boeke said they were a beaver blend-- don't know the percentage of beaver as opposed to nutria and rabbit or even collie dog.  I do know that the fur felt from Clearwater Hat Company does hold up well to weather and wear.  Reasonably priced as well.  Check out the BOP they have on their web site.

[Cyrille]

Nutria fur is water repelent not water proof, I talked to Boudreux 'bout that and he said"Cha' but them rats done ruined th muskrat trade, now they's gone to Marylan ta see what they kin ruin there but theys stil enough of them here to make a livin frum but oui mah frien they kinda lik otter they git wet but the skin stays dry.

[Mick Archer]

  Howdy Pards!
 
   "Carlsbad Crease" before there was a "Gus McCrae..."    

    But I was always fond of the much more future-dated,  "Karate Chop."      

    Mick Archer
    Who is about to "karate chop" a U.S. Model 1858 Dress Hat ("Hardee/Kossuth")  Possee

['Monterrey' Jack Brass]

S.S.

You have raised an excellent topic regarding the so-called 'Montana Peak'. The only source I have detailing it ad infinitum is on-loan right now to Mr Hunt (Jim - if you can post the Rawlins info regarding that subject the this thread it would be great). What Mr Rawlins writes is quite different than you might think regarding the origins of that hat-crush style.

Regarding sources for a proper repo Stetson: Clearwater (Boss of the Plains) is, in my opinion, the best one available right now. Tim Bender Hats makes an equivalent but is not as true as the Clearwater version, though definitely a close second. Go with the Clearwater and you will not be disappointed. I have one and I dare say it is my favorite hat of the three Clearwaters I own.

YMH&OS,

Monterrey J. B. 

[James Hunt]

WHAT? Brass remembered I had his copy of Rollins "The Cowboy" - man, now I'm goona have to buy my own copy.

Philip Ashton Rollins was born in 1869 of wealthy parents in the east who sent him west to their Montana ranch (which extended from Helena to the border of what is now Glacier National Park - that's big) each summer as a youth where he learned to cowboy and from all reports he loved it. Later trained as a historian at Princeton (BA and MA), he wrote a book of his experiences and knowledge that was published in 1922. His prose is that of an educated man, and contrasts with Abbot's work. Both are outstanding primary resources that compliment each other. In reading both, my impressions is that Abbot tends to cover the 1870's and 1880's while Rollins work speaks of the late 1870's thru the early 1890's.

Commenting on hats Rollins wrote:

"In the southwest, the crown was left at its full height, but its circumference above the summit of the wearer's head was contracted by three or, more commonly, four, vertical, equidistant dents, the resembling a mountain from whose sharp peak descended three or four deep gullies. In the northwest, the crown was left flat on top, but was so far telescoped by a pleat as to remain but approximately two and a half inches high.

"Few men of either section creased their hats in the manner of the other. A denizen of the Northwest appearing in a high-crowned hat was supposed to be putting on airs, and was subject openly to be accused of "chucking the Rio," vernacular for affecting the manners of the Southwesterners, whose dominant river was the Rio Grande. Present-day Northwesterners, faithless to this tradition, have foresworn the low crown and assumed the peak. The United states War Department recently has flown into the face of history by formally designating the dented high peak as the Montana Poke."

from 'The Cowboy', by Philip Aston Rollins, University of Oklahoma Press, 1997, p. 103

So what is this primary source telling us? First we are not sure what he means by 'southwest', my impression is that he is including west Texans. Did the Northwest then include Montana to the Oregon country. Assuming that, it would appear that the "Montana" peak originated in the "southwest" and not the northern plains where it would seem it was adopted along with the flat hat - where a high crown hat was trying to affect the appearance of the Rio Grande country. Further, the implication is that it was the US army that officially branded the name of "Montana Poke" on the style (although they may have stolen a popular expression of the period). As Rollins was basically describing the clothing of a cowboy of the 1880's and later we are probably safe in dating the design to that period.

This is the only primary source text I am aware of concerning the Montana Poke and it is noteworthy that writer attributes is first use to the southwest to be later adopted by the northwest cowboy.

[Ottawa Creek Bill]

James...

Great Stuff...I see the book(s) I'll be purchasing next!!

Bill