Chambering Barrel Liners

[Guns Garrett]

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A friend of mine asked me some advice the other day, and having no experience with it, if deferred my answer till I could get some good dope on it.  He is considering installing a .45 cal. barrel liner in his .43 Spanish Roller, and then rechambering it for .45-70 or .45-90.  I told him I wasn't sure the liner would be thick enough in the breech area to take the new chamber, or at least not thick enough to be safe.  Most barrel liners I've see for sale for .45-70 run about 5/8" O.D..  Can it be done?

[Fox Creek Kid]

He'd be better off to rebarrel. Then again, to rebarrel to the military configuration is hard as he has to find a 'smith who not only will install the barrel but turn down the blank to his specs. On a military roller you're shovelling sand into the ocean unless you want to sporterize it. And that isn't cheap. He'd almost be dollars ahead to just buy a new rifle IMHO.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

In Canada, possessing or rebarreling a pre-1898 single shot in a calibre greater than 8mm results in NO requirement to register! 

PRICELESS!

[Steel Horse Bailey]

In Canada, possessing or rebarreling a pre-1898 single shot in a calibre greater than 8mm results in NO requirement to register! 

PRICELESS!

Another good one, Sir Chaz!

[Hell-Er High Water]

This reply is a little late on this subject, but I just found it.

I have relined several rifles, Remington Rolling Blocks and Martini's to 45 Colt, 45-70 and 50-70.  The two 45 caliber liners are 5/8" diameter and the 50-70 liners are 11/16" diameter.  These diameters leave pleanty of material for chambering.  The best way to chamber the liners for these rimmed cartridges is to have the front edge of the rim butt up against the rear of the liner and not worry about chambering for the rim itself.

I epoxy the liners in the drilled out barrels and I have some that have been in for twenty (20) or more years with no sign of loosening.  When the liners are chambered in this manner a fired or new case can be used to to set the headspace in the rifle while the epoxy is hardening.  You can cut any excess liner off after the epoxy is set and face off the muzzle and the liner or you can cut the liner to length before installation and maintain the original muzzle configuration.  Extractor cuts are then cut using the original barrel cuts as a guide.  This usually can be done by hand with suitable files.

45-70 liners used to be available from Numerich Arms but I don't think that they handle them any more.  Recently I have been buying my liners from T. J.'s Gateway Enterprises, 3652 Neltner Road, Alexandria, KY 41001, 859/635-5560.  I have been very pleased with them.  They are good shooters and he sells them by the inch so you can get whatever length that you need.  A caliber and price list is available if you are interested.

This has extended the useful life of otherwise worn out guns without going to the cost of a rebarrel job and maintains all external barrel markings and sight mounting cuts or holes.

I hope that this provides some insite on this subject.

HHW

[Ol Gabe]

H. E. H. W.,
Have read the same on other forums and want to say a BIG "THANK YOU!" for repeating it here as it gives a solid response to any of the questions that .43 Spanish buyers have.
Myself, I almost bought one a number of years ago at a really, really, really great price (read under $100, ARGH!), but didn't because the local Smithies' didn't know how to make the changeover. Fortunately now we have a reliable guy that has the knowledge, and like you, has the knack and the touch!
Best regards and good lining!
'Ol Gabe
P.S. Still looking for a pristine .43 Spanish for under $100, and doubting if it'll ever appear!

[Texas Scout]

Thanks H.E.H.W.
 I have been thinking about the same project.
I do have a question though, do you cut the chamber in the liner before you epoxy it in place?

[Hell-Er High Water]

T. S.,

Yes, I chamber the liner before installation.  As noted before, I do not chamber the rim portion of the case in the liner and that way you can use an empty cartridge case to set the headspace before the epoxy hardens, being careful not to epoxy the case into the liner.  A little release agent (oil or grease) on the case and in the chamber solves this potential problem.

If need any other info just let me know.

HHW

[Dogeater]

I have been searching for somebody to reline a 50-70 military 1871 Springfield-Sharps. The bore is about "fair" and it "tumbles" about one out of five rounds fired.  I have loaded everything from Lyman 515141s, 515142s and a couple from NEI moulds that throw bullets ~590gr(+/-) and still get the "tumblers".  I don't want to rebarrel because it will be almost impossible to create the original "look". Does anybody build reliners for 50 cal.? Any help will be greatly appreciated Thanks, Dogeater

[Arizona Trooper]

Check with Bobby Hoyt on Fairfield Pa.  717-642-6696. Call after noon east coast time. He has done a number of liners for me and I have always been happy. He and is very familiar with Sharps.

[Trailrider]

I have been searching for somebody to reline a 50-70 military 1871 Springfield-Sharps. The bore is about "fair" and it "tumbles" about one out of five rounds fired.  I have loaded everything from Lyman 515141s, 515142s and a couple from NEI moulds that throw bullets ~590gr(+/-) and still get the "tumblers".  I don't want to rebarrel because it will be almost impossible to create the original "look". Does anybody build reliners for 50 cal.? Any help will be greatly appreciated Thanks, Dogeater

What diameter bullet are you shooting? The most current bullet sizing dies that I've seen are .512", but the original effective groove diameter of these barrels required .515" or larger bullets.  Even with BP, you might want to try harder cast bullets that won't strip in the rifling. Alternatively, you might see about a hollow base bullet mould, and a dead soft bullet or at least no harder than 1:20 tin:lead.  I'd certainly experiment before going to the expense of relining the barrel.

[Dogeater]

Thanks,Trooper &Trailrider, I'll try Bobby Hoyt on Monday. All the stuff I've cast so far has miked out  at .515, is pan-lubed w/ SPG. and unsized. My brass has all been fireformed and not resized. All rounds I've (unsuccessfully) tried in the rifle shoot fine in my Sharps carbine, my Rolling Blocks and my Peabody.  I've tried 30-1, 20-1, and pure lead. I'll try some Lyman # 2 that I have on hand and mix up some harder stuff  later and try that.  All the loads I've tried were with Goex 2f or some Cleanshot that was given to me. I've used varying charges from 67-75 gr. I am one of the old hard heads--I won't use smokeless or jacketed rounds in an old piece. I won't even use gas checked bullets.  I'll bet you were confused with the terminology I used in my original query. I am an old guy (72) and have a tendency to coin my own words/phrases. To this old guy, a "keyhole" is a bullet strike that hits the target slightly tilted and makes an off-round hole-a "tumbled" bullet is one that strikes flat @ 90 deg to the bore's axis (an extreme keyhole).   It's almost  midnight-I think I'll go to my loading room and cast up some stuff for tomorrow. Thanks, again.  I'll keep you posted on my progress(if any).
Dogeater 

[rbertalotto]

Talk about digging up a thread from the Archives!

I have a Winchester 1873 that I'm going to line the barrel. It is 38-40 and I'm going to keep it the same cartridge.

I love the idea of chambering the barrel to the rim and them installing using a case as a headspace gauge. Brilliant!

My question....Do you do the drilling totally from the muzzle without removing the barrel from the action? Or do you remove the barrel, drill from both end and then reinstall to insert the liner?

I'm a little concerned about removing a barrel from a 128 year old firearm.

I have a large lathe that I'll use for the drilling and I will support the barreled receiver through the headstock with spider on the outboard side.

The drill I have is 15" long and the barrel is 24". I can braze an extention onto the drill shank to length if needed.

Any comments or advise ia appreciated.

Thanks!

[silcott0351]

Does anyone here have the ability to reline a Uberti Henry rifle in 44-40, or know someone that can, and do a good job at it. I just had it relined by a person mentioned in this thread and I'd like to have it done right this time. The throat is so far forward I'd be better off shooting .444 out of it instead of 44-40. Feel free to email me directly with any information.

Thank you!
Heath Silcott
heathsilcott@yahoo.com

[rbertalotto]

I contacted two smiths that do this type of work and are recommended. Both were 6 months out.

So I bought the parts and did it myself to an old Winchester 1873

You can read all about it here:

www.rvbprecision.com