IAB Sharps

[IE300]

 
LOOKS LIKE PERFECT WEATHER AGAIN TODAY! OFF TO THE RANGE AND I CAN'T USE BAD WEATHER AS AN EXCUSE FOR POOR PERFORMANCE EITHER WITH MYSELF OR MY RIFLE SETUP. NOW IT'S UP TO ME AND IAB!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
             LAST SHOTS AT THE LITTLE BIGHORN WERE WITH A SHARPS RIFLE WITH TELESCOPIC SCOPE SIGHT FIRED BY
                                       First Sergeant Ryan  M Co. 7th U.S. Calvary At The Little Big Horn

"Captain French of my company asked me if I could do anything with those Indians, as they were out of range of the carbines.  I told the captain that I would try, and as I was the owner of a 15-pound Sharps telescope rifle, caliber .45, which I had made in Bismark before the expedition started out, and which cost me $100 I fired a couple of shots until I got the range of that group of Indians.  Then I put in half a dozen shots in rapid succession, and those Indians scampered away from that point of the bluff, and that ended the firing on the part of the Indians in that memorable engagement, and the boys put up quite a cheer.
 
Shortly thereafter, the Indian village began leaving the Little Big Horn Valley and the encirclement of the troops on the bluffs was over.  Ryan and Captain French fired the last shots of the battle:
 
"When they moved, the captain of my company, Thomas H. French, and I fired into them while they remained in the range of our two guns, and those were the last shots fired in the Battle of the Little Big Horn.  That was well known by every man in Reno's position."
 

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Awesome!  I hadn't heard this.

$100 !!!!!  That was quite expensive!

[IE300]

$100. for a rifle back in those days was one heck of a lot of money, and I'm sure it must have been the best that money could buy. A quick check of the internet suggests that $1.00 in 1876 was the equivalent of $32. now. There are so many variables that it is impossible to make a direct correlation between that value of currency at different times in our nations history, but the formula I found gives an overall indicater of monitar comparison between today and 1876. Using that formula would suggest that that Sharps rifle with scope cost the equivalent of $3,200. today, which I find pretty interesting. That amount is really pretty much in line with what one would pay for a similar rifle with scope today! You could certainly pay more or less, but I think this really is a pretty valid comparison of value. A good Sharps rifle with scope cost a lot than, and it cost a lot now.
Of course back in those days a productive hunter could recoup his investment fairly quickly, especially at the height of the buffalo hyde market. Now we have to recoup our investment in terms of satisfaction of ownership and enjoyment in using our rifles, 'cause we sure ain't going to pay for our rifles by selling Buffalo skins! Guess I'll have to settle for holding my cheapo Sharps while I watch Quigley Down Under again.
One other thing a lot of people don't know about the Battle of Little Big Horn is that there were actually 3 Custer brothers who died there. We all know about George Custer, and a lot of people know that his brother Thomas was a Captain who also died in that battle. He carried an Officer's Model Springfield Trapdoor, which must have been quite a prize for the Indian who was quick enough to pick it up! I have one of the H&R Officer's Models and I love it. Shoots pretty good, and from what I understand it's a fairly faithful rendition of the originals. I think of Thomas Custer every time I hold it. Boston Custer is almost never heard about. Most people don't know he even existed, much less know that he also died at the Little Big Horn. He was a civilian who was employed as a forager for the troops in the field. I don't know if he served with his Brother's continually, or if he just happened to be unlucky enough to be serving with them when they had their last engagement. I don't know what kind of rifle he carried, but I think it's safe to assume it was most likely a Springfield Trapdoor. I wonder if he died trying to pry an empty shell out of the chamber?
Still haven't tried my Sharps yet. I was packed up and ready to go to the range when I got a call about a flooded basement in one of my buildings. Seems like somebody up there doesn't want me to try out that Sharps! Maybe next weekend.

[Advertising]

[cpt dan blodgett]

Think Tom Custer was one of a handful of folks to be awarded the medal of honor twice and the only soldier in the civil war to recieve it twice for separate actions. 

[IE300]

You are absolutley right about Thomas winning the Medal of Honor twice. The second time he received it was at Sayler's Creek during a rebel counterattack. He had just jumped his horse over the rebel breastworks, and while reaching for the enemy flag he was shot in the face at point blank range by the color bearer. After Thomas shot the man dead, he yelled to his brother,"Armstrong, the damned rebels have shot me, but I've got my flag!" The bullet went in his cheek and exited his neck. He wanted to keep fighting, but his brother placed him under arrest and sent  him to the surgeon. They were some kind of soldiers back in those days.
I recently read a book titled CUSTER AND THE LITTLE BIGHORN by Jim Donovan, which has that and a lot of other very interesting and well researched information. Anybody interested in US Western history from that timeframe would certainly enjoy it. Not only that, but I got this $29.95 hardcover with lots of great illustrations for $9.95 at Barnes & Nobel, and last I looked they still had them on their bargain shelf. One heck of a deal, and I think I'll give it a second read real soon!

[IE300]

Well I finally got out to the range with my IAB Sharps today. Based on my experience I now am of the opinion that at least in the case of my rifle, IAB stands for Incredible Awsome Buffalo Sharps! I don't doubt that some people may have gotten bad guns made by IAB, and maybe I just lucked out. Maybe it depends on the branding of any particular rifle. Mine's an Armi S. Marco marked rifle, and in fact I didn't even know it was an IAB until I removed the forend and saw the IAB stamp on the underside of the barrel. All I knew until today was that I had finally gotten a Sharps rifle, and that it looked pretty nice. Pretty nice wood, pretty good wood to metal and metqal to metal fit, and overall pretty nice finish. Not the best I've ever seen, but still nicer than a lot of guns I've owned over the years. And after installing the full length Malcolm scope on it, I thought it was a pretty nice looking package. But I didn't get to shoot it until today.
Today I used Ultramax 45-70 ammo I got from Buffalo Arms. First shot I couldn't believe how mild the recoil was; downright pleasent to shoot compared to the other 45-70's I've had, such as my H&R Officer's Model Trapdoor. I guess the weight of that full octagon 28" heavy barrel has a lot to do with it. Since I wanted to get the scope sighted in, I started out at 50 yards today. First shot was about 8" low and 8" to the left. I tweeked the elevation and the second shot was still 8" to the left with the elevation dead on. Next 4 shots I used Kentucky windage by aiming 8" to the right with center elevation and was rewarded with about a 3" group. 2 shots touching each other next to 2 more touching each other, with about an inch between the 2 pairs. Now I'm gettin' happy!
During the break I tweeked the windage to bring everything about 8" to the right, and that did the trick. The rest of my 20 shots were all pretty much where I placed my crosshairs, making 2 and 3 shot gouups around different areas of the target.
Once I had the scope initially sighted in, my point of impact stayed put without shifting. The cheapo Leatherwood precission scope mounts held their settings, at least for this 20 rounds. The scope itself was nice and clear and bright, and seemingly returned to zero even with the sliding mount and my added on spring installed. By the way, my addition of the spring seemed to work like a charm, returning the scope to it's rearward firing position without having to manually return it by hand. I don't know if it helped absorb any recoil, but it definately returned to scope to position automatically, which was my intention when I installed it. I bought the spring for $3.50 at Tru Value, cut it to the proper length, opened it up the slightest amount and installed it around the scope tube under the sliding mount. A little lithium grease, and it's the cheapest add on to the whole set up!
Well, that was all I did with my Sharps today. Next time I'll move out to 100 yards and start to give the scope a little more of a work out. See if I can get some repeatability out of the mounts. Like I said previously, I did have to spend some time cleaning up and adjusting the mounts to get them smoothly operating. And there are definately a few things that I wont be able to correct, just have to learn to live with them. The main thing is that to adjust windage, you basically have to remove the elevator so you can move the scope tube up and out of the way in order to unlock and relock the screw that locks the windage adjustments once that have been made. It is a pain, but I don't see any way to make that lock screw accessable without moving the tube out of the way. The good news is that hopefully I will be able to get the windage dead nut on, lock it in position, and never have to adjust it again. In reality I should really only have to adjust elevation with my distance, and the elevator lock is a knurled knob on the right side of the mount and easily accessable. I could see maybe replacing that lock knob with one a little larger so I could tourque it down with my thumb and forfinger a little easier, but if I decided to do that it would be a piece of cake. Either find a larger know with the same threads, or silver solder a larger wheel to the one already installed.
As I get more range time with this rifle and scope, I'm sure I will find other things that need to be made right, but so far I think that someone with a little skill and patience can take this setup and make it work well.
As for the rifle itself, while some people say that IAB stands for It's Always Broke, on mine it stands for It Ain't Broke. Oh yeah, did I mention that I have about a little under $1,200. into my Sharps Rifle with the Full Length Malcolm Scope? So maybe after all is said and done I could say it's an ISAB, 'cause I got my dream rifle and "I still ain't broke!"
 
I'LL KEEP YA' POSTED AFTER I DO SOME MORE SHOOTIN' MY SHARPS

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Cool!

[cpt dan blodgett]

Wondering if most of my problems associated with my Armi Sports are sight and 61 y/o eyes related.

Time will tell when I come off the bucks for some decent Soule sights with an adjusable eyepiece.

[IE300]

WARNING! AFTER WRITING THIS POST i REALIZE I DID IT AGAIN AND WROTE WAY TOO MUCH. WISH I COULD SAY I WAS SORRY, BUT i AIN'T! I JUST GOTTA LET IT OUT WHEN THE URGE HITS. OK, I'M A LITTLE SORRY.
Not to get things any more confused than they already are, but my IAB Sharps is an Armi S. Marco ( or so marked as such on the top of the barrel) and from reading lots of posts on different forums, I have been given to understand that Armi Sports is a different company altogether. To further confuse things there is also an Armi San Paolo, and all three of the Italian companies are in similar businesses. There seems to be a lot of crossover in these businesses, and many of them are either affiliated directly or indirectly.
Here is the way IAB, Armi San Marco and Armi Sport are described by Blue Book of Modern Black Powder Arms - Online Subscription.

Armi San Marco
Previous manufacturer located in Gardone, Italy, acquired by American Western Arms, Inc. in 2000 and reorganized as American Western Arms, Italia. See American Western Arms Inc. listing. Previously imported by E.M.F., located in Santa Ana, CA, and sold through E.M.F., Traditions, Cabela´s, and other retail gun stores.
All Armi San Marco black powder cap and ball and cartridge conversion models were discontinued in 2000.
In 1993, the Hartford line was introduced by E.M.F. These models have steel frames with German silver plated backstrap and trigger guard, inspector´s cartouche on grip, and trade for approximately $20-$40 higher than standard Armi San Marco versions.

Armi Sport
Current manufacturer established in 1958, and located in Brescia, Italy. Currently imported by Chiappa Firearms, Ltd. located in Dayton, OH. Currently distributed by Cimarron F.A. Co. located in Fredericksburg, TX, Collector's Armoury, Ltd. located in Lorton, VA, Maxsell Corp. located in Coconut Creek, FL, Taylor´s & Co., Inc., located in Winchester, VA, Traditions Inc. located in Old Saybrook, CT, and Valor Corp. located in Sunrise, FL. Previously distributed by I.A.R. Inc. located in San Juan Capistrano, CA, KBI Inc. then located in Harrisburg, PA, and until 2009 by E.M.F. Company Inc., located in Santa Ana, CA.
Armi Sport manufactures top quality reproductions of famous rifles/carbines. Please refer to the distributors' listings for current information on these models, including U.S. pricing and availability. For more information and current pricing on both new and used Armi Sport firearms, please refer to the Blue Book of Gun Values by S.P. Fjestad (available online also).

IAB
Previous manufacturer (Industria Armi Bresciane) of modern firearms, black powder replicas, and historical Sharps rifles located in Gardone, Val Trompia, Brescia, Italy until closing July, 2009. Previously imported by E.M.F., located in Santa Ana, CA, Dixie GunWorks, located in Union City, TN, Kiesler's, located in Jeffersonville, IN, and Tristar Sporting Arms, located in Kansas City, MO.
Please refer to individual importer/distributor listing in this text for model information and pricing.

When all is said and done, my guess is that they amount to one big consortium with each company having certain specialties regarding models produced, qualities offered, etc., and that it is probably difficult to determine who actually makes what. Back in the 1980's I owned a company that imported knives from a number of Italian companies, and I had the pleasure to go in person to a town called Maniago Italy. The whole town is basically dedicated to knife making, with companies like Beltrame and at least a dozen others located there. To do business there you had to work through a representitive who would make sure that not only the customers interests were met, but also make sure all the different companies had a shot at getting a reasonable amount of business. One of the ways this was accomplished was to structure the purchases so that sometimes you would be buying from someone other than the actual manufacturer. Not a manufacturers rep, but another manufacturer who might not be able to produce the actual item being purchased. I never came close to understanding the whole system, but in essence it was in place to assure that all companies had opportunities to make sales, thereby allowing them to stay in business even during times when their particlar product might not be in high demand. It was a very Italian way of doing business, and I would guess that it is somewhat similar to the way the gun businesses run. And probably all manufacturing in Italy is done in a similar way.
 I'll tell you one thing. At the end of the day the business people took us out to a local outdoor cafe for a glass of wine. Between the beautiful girl serving the wine and the view of the mountains of Northern Italy, there was something to be said for the Italian way of doing business.
Getting back to your comment, my eyes are only 58 years old. But they aren't getting any better, and I sure do appreciate the view I get through that Malcolm scope. The 3/4" tube doesn't give you a real wide view, but once you get used to it, it sure seems to beat the heck out of trying to shoot with my bare eyes. I hope you get that Soule sight you're thinking about, and that it does the job for you. I know the good ones will set you back as much as a scope, but I also know that a lot of people swear by 'em. One thing is for sure. Both the good Soule sight and the Malcolm scope look awful good on a Sharps rifle. Whatever you choose, keep it close to your Cowboy Heart and it'll bring you a lot of pleasure. After my first 20 rounds in my cheapo Sharps, I'm hooked. I've never had a rifle that looked or felt so good. Cant wait to see what I can do with it when I get out to a couple of hunderd yards!

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

IE300;  No problems today.  I'm in a better mood, and healthier than when we "spoke' earlier. 
In fact, this post contains a wealth of information.  I commend you for your research.

[IE300]

Why Thank you Sir Charles!
        I never took offense at anything you said. One of my few strong points is having a good sense of humor about myself and my many shortcommings. Since we can't be perfect, we may as well be able to laugh at our own imperfections. And that's all I have to say about that. Pretty short, huh?
Cowboy Up and Boney Notches

[IE300]

HOWDY PARDNERS! THOUGHT YOU ALL MIGHT LIKE TO GET A LOOK AT THE GUY WHO WRITES THOSE GOD AWFUL LONG POSTS! I WAS NEVER PRETTY AND I'M GETTIN' MORE NOT PRETTY AS I GET OLDER. BUT MY CAT AND DOG'S DON'T CARE AND MY WIFE ONLY HAS TO LOOK AT ME A FEW TIMES A YEAR. I GOTTA LOOK IN THE MIRROR EVERY DAY, BUT I JUST SAY "DON'T PAY ANY ATTENTION TO THAT OLD GUY IN THE MIRROR. HE DON'T BITE, AND IF HE DID HE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH TEETH TO HURT YOU TOO MUCH ANYWAY." HASTA LUIGI AND BONEY NOTCHES!

PS- SIR CHARLES LOOKS A HECK OF A LOT BETTER THAN ME. HE'S GOTTA LITTLE BIT OF A TOM SELLECK THING GOING ON. BEST WATCH OUT THAT THE GIRLS DON'T CROWD YOU TOO MUCH SIR CHARLES! (I'M ASSUMING THAT REALLY IS A PICTURE OF YOU)
I GUESS STEEL HORSE AND ME WILL HAVE TO FIGHT OVER SIR CHARLES LEFT OVERS!

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

Yep! That is the real me.  I have to admit that it was taken on a analog camera and scanned later.  I'm sure there is at least another 10 years on that Ol Mug by now!

[IE300]

Well don't go takin' it the wrong way, but you were at least a handsome cowboy back 10 years ago. For myself, I don't think anything's finer than a perty girl dressed in western style with a skirt and cowgirl boots to frame her legs. But at my age I have to settle for just lookin' now and then. You know yer gettin' old when your wife just laughs at you when she see's you lookin' at a young girl. But I guess as long as my eyes still work, I'll still look at the girls and the bullseyes. On a good day I even get to reach out and touch the bullseyes every now and then. The girls I have to settle for just lookin' at. Not allowed to shoot my pistol much anymore, just get to play with it a little and then put it back in it's holster. I best change the subject next time before I get myself in trouble. See you on the horizon!

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Lookin' at girls ...

Just 'cause I'm on a diet, doesn't mean I can't read the menu!

[IE300]

Be nice to have a pretty cowgirl help me reload my 45-70 shells now and than, though. Ya' know.....somebody who could seat my primers and cast my bullets.  Just have to settle for holdin' my Cheapo Sharps real close on those cold Winter nights, and do my own reloadin'. Oh well. Maybe next lifetime......

[cpt dan blodgett]

Got to love it, where else can discussions go from what some consider an inferior pore quality rifle to pic of a gal that appears to have absolutely nothing wrong with her!!!!!

[IE300]

That's exactly the point. My opinion is now that contrary to what some have said, the IAB Sharps Rifle, at least the one I have, is the firearms equivalent of this young lady in terms of quality. I didn't put this picture up for gratuatous reasons at all, but to make an analogy between the actual fine quality of the rifle in question and the obvious quality of this fine western gal. This was posted strictly for the purpose of enhansing the intellectual aspects of this discussion by means of comparrison. 

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

This was posted strictly for the purpose of enhansing the intellectual aspects of this discussion by means of comparrison.  

Yeah! Right!

Like this;

[Ranch 13]

I'm glad your rifle is working for you, but 20 rounds is won't even get the barrel broke in, let alone be a test of the quality of the rifle.
 Yes those rifles are fun, yes they can be accurate, but they didn't get the reputation of "it's always broke" for nothing.