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CAS TOPICS => Gunsmithing => Topic started by: Deadeye Douglas on December 06, 2017, 11:23:23 pm



Title: Uberti Cattleman 'sticky' cylinder, won't rotate.
Post by: Deadeye Douglas on December 06, 2017, 11:23:23 pm
Hi all,

I've got an Uberti Cattleman that will work fine for 3 or so rounds, but the last 2-3 are always extremely sticky. It becomes difficult to cock the hammer and rotate the cylinder. If I put in snap caps it seems to work fine. These are smokeless by the way and the gun is well cleaned.

Any idea what's going on?


Title: Re: Uberti Cattleman 'sticky' cylinder, won't rotate.
Post by: Abilene on December 06, 2017, 11:45:02 pm
...Any idea what's going on?

Could be several things.  Most likely is your ammo.  Reloads?  Low power?  Primers back out on too low pressured loads and then drag on the recoil shield when they come around again.  Check your empties for backed out primers (scrape marks on primer).  If that is not the problem, then we can look at mechanical things.


Title: Re: Uberti Cattleman 'sticky' cylinder, won't rotate.
Post by: Baltimore Ed on December 07, 2017, 09:51:44 am
Think you're on the right track there Abilene.
FYI. When you fire a cartridge firearm the primer ignites the powder charge and pressure builds up in the case until it overcomes the resistance of the brass case's hold on the bullet. The bullet goes down the bbl while the case expands tightly against the chamber walls and doesn't move. The primer backs out and slams against the breach face which is where the cratering and edge flattening happens in very hot loads, the primer metal flows into the firing pin hole around the firing pin. Military ammunition has crimped primers to prevent this from happening. As the pressure drops the elastic brass case shrinks slightly losing it's grip on the chamber (otherwise it wouldn't extract) and moves backwards against the breach face, which reseats the primer back into the primer pocket (where the junk in the primer pocket comes from). An intentional too light load, ruptured case or squib will back out the primer but not reseat it by having enough pressure to move the case. The popped out primer is then jammed against the frame of the revolver which locks the cylinder up. This primer movement causes the firing pin primer smears on brass fired in automatics. Bullets move but primers do too.


Title: Re: Uberti Cattleman 'sticky' cylinder, won't rotate.
Post by: Capt Quirk on December 07, 2017, 11:10:47 am
I have a Cattleman, and never experienced this. I only use store bought rounds, so is this only custom loads causing the problem?


Title: Re: Uberti Cattleman 'sticky' cylinder, won't rotate.
Post by: August on December 07, 2017, 11:29:31 am
Douglas, would you please describe the loads you are using that are related to this issue?  Bullet weight, powder, charge weight, crimp procedure.   That should get us dialed in pretty quick.


Title: Re: Uberti Cattleman 'sticky' cylinder, won't rotate.
Post by: Deadeye Douglas on December 07, 2017, 06:02:08 pm
Thanks everyone, it's possible it could be cases backing out, but I think I've used more than one brand of ammo and had it happen. Last I used was Winchester Super X, 250gr LFN. The primers don't look backed out any.

Someone with the same model and serial range (7th cav ed.) mentioned there was a step on the left side of the recoil shield that he was getting hung up on. I can see and clearly feel that step.

What's odd is that this didn't used to happen, its just been occurring on the last 3 or so outings.



Title: Re: Uberti Cattleman 'sticky' cylinder, won't rotate.
Post by: Abilene on December 07, 2017, 06:11:43 pm
Nope, not your ammo I don't think.  Factory ammo primer backing out would be rare.  And since it didn't used to do it, that is good info as well. 


Title: Re: Uberti Cattleman 'sticky' cylinder, won't rotate.
Post by: Baltimore Ed on December 07, 2017, 06:19:00 pm
Is your cylinder pin backing out. I know that a backed out pin will bind up the cylinder. Factory ammunition is a lot warmer than what cas shooters generally use, more recoil, so I would check how the cylinder pin is secured in the frame. My one Uberti revolver has a little screw with a big head to secure the pin.


Title: Re: Uberti Cattleman 'sticky' cylinder, won't rotate.
Post by: August on December 08, 2017, 10:24:38 am
I have had to shim the cylinder on both my Pietta's to reduce the endshake to the point where primers get reseated consistently.  When the endshake gets excessive, the whole case backs out of the cylinder and doesn't "reseat" when firing.  But, adjusting the endshake (headspace) cured this problem on both of my pistols.  Using feeler gauges, measure the headspace/endshake with cases in the cylinders and the cylinder pushed as far forward in the frame as it will go.  Then, adjust from there.  Observe the barrel/cylinder gap as you do this.  On my pistols, the cylinder could/would actually contact the barrel when pushed forward.  When the gun was fired, that's where the binding occurred.  The cylinder on your pistol probably needs to be set back to prevent this binding. 

I strongly recommend the Shim Pack, which has a range of thicknesses, from: https://www.triggershims.com/cylinder_shims.html#S9

I have yet to meet an eyetalian pistol that didn't require work on the base pin, or cylinder extension, or adjustment of endshake.   They've all been timed well and lock up well, but the subtleties of fitting cylinders to frames seems to have eluded team Ferrari.  They seem to 'think' the press-fit cylinder bushing somehow, magically produces a proper end-shake dimension.  In my experience, it doesn't.

When the end shake is excessive, the fired cases protrude from the cylinder and cause the pistol to bind at the front of the cylinder, at the barrel.  You can confirm this by looking for scrape marks on the front of your cylinder.  While you're there, check that the end of the barrel and the cylinder are, in fact, parallel to one another.  


Title: Re: Uberti Cattleman 'sticky' cylinder, won't rotate.
Post by: Deadeye Douglas on December 08, 2017, 03:26:23 pm
Thanks for the advice, I will make sure the cylinder pin is not moving next time I fire it.

I don't see any evidence of wear or scrapes on the front or back of the cylinder. Just in the slots where the hand rotates the cylinder.