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Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  Special Interests - Groups & Societies  |  STORM (Moderators: RRio, Major 2)  |  Topic: 1860 R/M Conversion Question 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: 1860 R/M Conversion Question  (Read 1955 times)
MikeM.
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« on: January 24, 2018, 10:47:07 pm »


I am looking at a Cimarron Type II 1860 Conversion and was just curious about something. Did any original guns ever have iron trigger guards or were they all brass?? Most I see are brass so if I buy it, I will probably change the iron one out for brass, Anybody know a part number from VTI that won't need a ton of fitting or is there somewhere else that sells one closer to what I would need? Are they expensive??
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Coffinmaker
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« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2018, 01:26:58 pm »

Hi Mike,

Well, you be talking about Apples, Oranges, Lemons and Limes.  The Colt 1860 was made with Both Iron and Brass trigger guard/Back strap.  The 1860 was also made with both Army Pattern and '51 Navy pattern Grip Sets.  Colt would convert anything you sent them so long as it was mechanically sound.  Bottom line here is any Colt pattern Grip Set can be "correct."

Now ... "a ton of fitting" or ..... One's definition of a ton of fitting is dependent.  First and foremost, a Lustrum or two ago, Uberti "standardized" their frame dimensions, screw locations and screws.  This means new build Uberti Grip Frames are interchangeable throughout the SA line.  Example, a BP 1860 Grip Set will mount to an 1873 Mdl P.  The actual fit will NOT be exact.  Close, but not exact.  Brass is much much much easier to fit than steel.  Surface brass to dimension and polish .. done.  Steel .. re-blue.

Then ... The search for your hearts' desire.  VTI Gunparts.  VTI carries "sets."  The sets include Trigger Guard, Back Strap and finished wood, all of which have been fit to the factory "buck" and fit to each other.  Not cheap but damn convenient.  Highly recommended.  I have used a LOT of them.

Bon Appetite
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MikeM.
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« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2018, 08:31:02 pm »

I saw those and that is what it will be ., I wonder if they come with the “44cal” marking on trigger guard? If not I will get it done.... thanks for the info
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MikeM.
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« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2018, 06:01:44 pm »

Well that part is out of stock so I am gong to try my hand at fitting the UB040026 brass trigger guard. I did this before but it may have been before the screw placement was standardized as I had to do some pretty heavy fitting to it. Has anybody here done one of these lately ? If so, how much fitting was required and did all the flat srifaces butt up evenly? I ask this because the one that I fitted did not sit flat to the part of backstrap that makes contact with the trigger guard. There was a wedge shaped void there and I had to make a shim to put there. I hope the new ones fit squarely.
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Crow Choker
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« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2018, 07:25:48 pm »

Check out Cimarron and Taylors parts also. I've priced parts and screws from them and VTI and in most cases they are cheaper than VTI if they have in stock. Taylors seems to be the lowest on average.
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Darksider-1911 Shooter-BOLD Chambers-RATS-SCORRS-STORM-1860 Henry(1866)-Colt Handgun Lover an' Fan-NRA-"RiverRat"-Conservative American Patriot and Former Keeper & Enforcer of the Law an' Proud of Being Both! >oo
Coffinmaker
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« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2018, 11:49:10 am »

Ah, yea, well ...... When you talk about Trigger guards and Back Straps that haven't been pre-fit to a buck or mated to each other, all bets are off.  Individual parts WILL require a bunch of fitting.  Unless you get incredibly lucky.  Buy a lotto ticket!!  As in:

A brass Trigger Guard will not be flat and square, it will not fit side to side and the verticals will not match the frame.  It will however, look just like a Trigger Guard.  Mostly.  Almost.  Throwing it against the wall will not help (Don't ask how I know this fact).
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Professor Marvel
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« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2018, 02:19:56 am »

A brass Trigger Guard will not be flat and square, it will not fit side to side and the verticals will not match the frame.  It will however, look just like a Trigger Guard.  Mostly.  Almost.  Throwing it against the wall will not help (Don't ask how I know this fact).

And that is when a small oxy torchand some brass brazing rod comes in handy.
build up more brassy material.
file it back "to fit"
hope the colors kinds match.

yhs
prof marvel
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MikeM.
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« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2018, 07:26:21 pm »

Ok guys, can anybody recommend a place to send my trigger guard to get “44cal” and serial number put on it? Had a guy in mind but can’t seem to get in touch with him..
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MikeM.
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« Reply #8 on: February 05, 2018, 07:17:01 pm »

Well , got the trigger guard in and it had a gouge in the brass so I had to send it back for exchange. I got the new one in and worked all morning fitting it . Really wasn’t too bad but then “it” appeared... a small pock on the brass that showed up after I had to change the front contour a little. I sanded and sanded and then figured out that this wasn’t a pock but the back side of the hammer spring hole. Uuuuuuuggghhh!!!!! It was looking so good too but for some reason Uberti drilled that hole really deep. So my guard was pretty much ruined at this point as I am no welder. The front grip contour is definitely the hardest part of fitting but really not that bad either. Just scribe the edge of the grips on it and sand to the marks. If not for that damn hole being so deep I would have it beautifully fit right now and sent off to have markings put on. I wish I could buy one with that hole undrilled and I could drill it myself. Is such thing available?? Will probably just wait until the full pre fit assembly is back in stock at VTI. I wonder if Cimarron sells that assembly too or IFG maybe??
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Abilene
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« Reply #9 on: February 05, 2018, 11:55:44 pm »

... I wonder if Cimarron sells that assembly too or IFG maybe??

You could call and ask, but last I knew Cimarron carries backstraps, triggerguards, and grips, but not as pre-fitted assemblies.  I have only fit a small number of revolver grips, but never had to do any filing or sanding on the gripframe.  Of course sanding on a finished grip goes through the finish, so it is always a good excuse to refinish it with an oil finish.

Did the TG you bought have '44 Cal' marked on it?  I'm pretty sure I've seen that on some spare parts TG's, but not positive.
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Professor Marvel
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« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2018, 12:13:47 am »

My Good Mike -
I am sorry to say I don;t have much useful to offer....
since you now have a brass hole to fill, now is as good a time as any to buy these and learn how.

torch
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bernzomatic-WK5500-Brazing-Torch-Kit-361487/300055608

brazing rod
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bernzomatic-WB5-Bronze-Flux-Coated-Brazing-and-Welding-Rods-334490/203710172

other brazing rod
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Lincoln-Electric-1-8-in-Flux-Coated-Brazing-Rods-1-lb-Tube-KH515/202715833?MERCH=REC-_-PIPHorizontal1_rr-_-203710172-_-202715833-_-N

learn new things! expand your horizons!  stimulate the economy!
one might want to practice on scrap first, tho.

yhs
prof marvel
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MikeM.
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« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2018, 06:05:10 am »

No , I was going to have it marked though.
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MikeM.
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« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2018, 08:34:25 pm »

Has anybody ever seen a picture of an original conversion with an iron trigger guard??
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Coffinmaker
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« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2018, 08:39:00 pm »

YES.
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Fox Creek Kid
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« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2018, 01:30:17 pm »

Has anybody ever seen a picture of an original conversion with an iron trigger guard??

In the McDowell book there is a '60 RM with an iron TG. Uberti does not stamp the cal. marking on TG's sold as parts that I have ever seen. I know a man with cal. stamps, but I don't know how to contact him anymore. Sorry.
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Trooper Smith
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« Reply #15 on: March 03, 2018, 04:57:30 pm »

I fitted the VTI Uberti brass guard to my nickel  and blued type 2 Richards with only minor fitting involved. The grips were a little proud so was able to reshape and refinish them as well with few coats of Tru Oil.
Have not got the .44CAL stamp but will look to getting that done in the future.


* 1860's.JPG (271.62 KB, 800x600 - viewed 62 times.)

* Type 2 Richards.JPG (222.51 KB, 800x600 - viewed 66 times.)
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