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Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  Special Interests - Groups & Societies  |  SCORRS (Moderator: Bull Schmitt)  |  Topic: Finally- The Outlaw lives! 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: Finally- The Outlaw lives!  (Read 1780 times)
Tinker Pearce
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« on: January 18, 2018, 01:03:16 am »


Because I am an idjit I tried everything to crimp my .44 Colt loads... except buying the collet-crimp die from Old West Bullet Molds. As a consequence I was never able to load satisfactory ammunition and properly enjoy my Pietta 1858 Cartridge Conversion. I finally caved and ordered the die, and a surprisingly few days later it arrived.

Naturally I clutched to my breast with glad cries and headed for the reloading bench, where to my surprise and delight... it didn't work. OK, a little adjustment and now... still doesn't work. I looked it over, then carefully removed a calculated amount of metal... from the wrong place. Now it really didn't work. Note to self- make sure you understand how a tool works before you modify it. Did I mention that I am an idjit?

I looked htings over again, figured out where I had gone wrong,  then did a couple minutes of careful lathe-work and tried it out. Success!  It now produced a strong crimp... and revealed that my brass was still slightly long. What the hell, it works, right? I'll trim 'em just a bit when I reload them.


That being sorted I cranked out fifty rounds, and trundled off to the range this afternoon to try it out. Worked, and I could finally enjoy this gun properly. Shoots pretty good, too!


I'm pleased as punch- not only do I get to enjoy this gun, but I have one, maybe two other .44 Colt projects waiting in the wings...
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Major 2
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« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2018, 05:22:35 am »

Far from an idjit ....all you did is add a punch to your Man card .... side's your handy work on "Outlaw" adds  "at a boy's" that erase
faux pas,  blunders and any DAM -dumb ass mistakes.



 
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« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2018, 12:04:03 pm »

Tinker, That is a SERIOUS crimp. Just how much bullet jump do your loads generate in that good looking revolver? I'd be afraid to shoot 'er myself. A very nice group though. We all can figure out how to break stuff but it takes real talent to figure out how to fix it. Nice.
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Tinker Pearce
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« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2018, 02:05:06 pm »

Tinker, That is a SERIOUS crimp. Just how much bullet jump do your loads generate in that good looking revolver? I'd be afraid to shoot 'er myself. A very nice group though. We all can figure out how to break stuff but it takes real talent to figure out how to fix it. Nice.

Yeah... I'm kinda new to this whole 'collet-crimp' thing. There will be some adjustments before I get dialed-in.
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« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2018, 05:10:20 pm »

Trim your brass. Bernie's crimps work very well if your brass is trimmed to work with them. I load .38 Long Colt heeled bullets from his molds with his heeled bullet crimper. OAL works out that Starline .38 LC brass needs to be trimmed down. Your pic shows exactly that problem. Trim your brass down to length so the crimp lays right.
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AntiqueSledMan
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« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2018, 07:49:33 pm »

Hello Tinker,

I think the crimp needs to be on the end of the case.
See how I set it up. Collet matches case while in shell holder.


* IMG_33.jpg (91.31 KB, 640x480 - viewed 89 times.)

* IMG_34.jpg (87.61 KB, 640x480 - viewed 85 times.)
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Tinker Pearce
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« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2018, 07:58:02 pm »

Hello Tinker,

I think the crimp needs to be on the end of the case.
See how I set it up. Collet matches case while in shell holder.

I'm certain that you are correct- my cases are very slightly too long. I'll shorten them to the appropriate length when I reload the cases.
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Marshal Will Wingam
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« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2018, 12:10:39 am »

Nice job. That's a serious crimp, though. Does it need all that? But, what the heck as long as it works?
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Tinker Pearce
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« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2018, 04:09:35 am »

Nice job. That's a serious crimp, though. Does it need all that? But, what the heck as long as it works?

Way more crimp than it needs, I am sure, but it's a new tool so I am still learning how to use it.  I'll get it dialed in soon enough!
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Marshal Will Wingam
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« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2018, 01:30:13 pm »

Thanks, fascinating project. Be sure to post pics as you go along.
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Tinker Pearce
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« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2018, 10:28:49 pm »

I needed to shorten my brass slightly but it's now placing the crimp exactly where it is needed. I use .44 Special dies to de-cap and slightly flare the case-mouth, and a modified .44 Special die to seat the bullets (they're too tight to just push in.) Then I use a collet-crimp die from Old West Bullet Moulds to finish the rounds.

Since my situation makes black powder problematic I'm loading the 200gr. HPRNFP bullets over 5.0 gr. of Unique with a CCI500 primer. This should be good for about 620-630 fps. / 173 ft./lbs. from my gun. Hardly a magnum, but I reckon it'll do the job.

Loading these rounds is a bit slower than loading modern ammunition, but I don't mind.
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« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2018, 03:16:02 am »

My Dear Tinker

Nicley done! thanks for posting!

yhs
prof amrvel
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Tinker Pearce
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« Reply #12 on: January 21, 2018, 04:46:52 am »

So here's a new wrinkle- after my last range session I noticed that two of the lock-notches on the cylinder have broken through. As it turns out this was quite common on original conversions- and it doesn't seem to matter.  Given how often this seems to have occurred in the past without apparently rendering the gun unserviceable I decided to test the gun regardless.

This is not as nuts as it sounds- bursting cylinders seldom damage the shooter, and other people on the range are protected by the walls of the shooting lane. Regardless it wasn't a problem. After fifty rounds fired (plus however many I fired after it happened in the first shooting session) there was no change in the holes, even under strong magnification. None of the brass blew through or even bulged into the holes, and the empties were not difficult to extract.

I would not recommend that anyone else fire a gun in this condition, and I will be ordering a new cylinder. I'll try to drill and ream the chambers of the new cylinder at a slight angle to see if I can avoid this. In the meantime I'll continue to shoot this gun and see what happens- as long as I can do so in conditions that do not endanger others.
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Coffinmaker
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« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2018, 11:40:43 am »

Hi Tinker,

Just a little tin bit or FYI if ya will.  Has been quite common in the past for Uberti Open Top cylinders in 45 Colt to spit out the really really thin piece of metal in the bottom of the locking bolt notches.  There were no problems with any of the guns I worked on after they did this.  Several folks elected to send their cylinders back for replacement, others did not.  There was no change to function and no further problems with the guns without the little piece of metal.  I would not be at all nervous to continue using your cylinder.
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Tinker Pearce
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« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2018, 11:52:25 am »

Thanks Coffinmaker! That's reassuring.
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Marshal Will Wingam
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« Reply #15 on: January 21, 2018, 12:28:44 pm »

Those cartridges look good. Nice job, there.
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