Javascript DHTML Drop Down Menu Powered by dhtml-menu-builder.com
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
October 17, 2018, 04:59:32 am

Login with username, password and session length

Search:     Advanced search
* Home FlashChat Help Calendar Login Register
Currently there are 0 Users in the Cas City Chat Rooms!
Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  CAS TOPICS  |  The Powder Room - CAS reloading (Moderator: Professor Marvel)  |  Topic: .44-40 revolver/rifle sizing 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
Pages: [1] Go Down Print
Author Topic: .44-40 revolver/rifle sizing  (Read 1470 times)
Little Dalton
Top Active Citizen
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 103


-ad regem-


WWW
« on: December 29, 2017, 12:40:29 pm »


So I have a Cimarron/Uberti 7.5" Old Model 1873 Colt clone in .44WCF. I have been buying bullets for the last 3 years, and really need to start casting my own. I have experience, just no mold yet. I also want to buy (sometime in the unforeseeable future) a current production Uberti '73 Winchester in the same caliber, and have Jared at Long Hunter's do some very basic, NCOWS-approved tuning on it. I'm going to go ahead and get a 43-215C mold from Accurate, and I'm trying to carefully plan my sizing system- size of mold, and size of sizing die.

I want to be able to craft ONE BP load for both guns, and get optimum function AND long(er)-range accuracy out of both guns. I have a couple of questions.

On my revolver, the bore slugs at .429", and the chamber mouths all slug .432" pretty consistently. Better than undersized I guess, but in y'all's experience, is that too much difference? Or just about right?

On the future rifle, I am hearing that current production '73s are pretty consistently having a .429" bore size. Is this correct? I want to be able size everything to one size for both guns, and I can buy another sizing die later if need be, but I want to be sure and order a big enough mold.

I am thinking of ordering a mold that throws a minimum  .431" boolit in soft lead (I use whatever lead I can get my hands on, with a preference for pure), and ordering a .430" sizing die. Think the .431" cast size will be big enough for a future rifle, or should I make it bigger just to be safe?

On another note, does anyone experience any chambering issues with using boolits .001" over groove diameter in current production Uberti .44-40/.44WCF guns, either revolvers or rifles? TIA!
Logged

Jordan Goodwin

Blacksmithing, woodworking, history nut, entrepreneur, and work at home.

Hand forged gun hooks over on the website:
www.axe-and-anvil.com

"Blessed be the Lord my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight." (Ps. 144:1)

Reckon so.
Trailrider
CAS-L Ghost Rider
Top Active Citizen
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2073



WWW
« Reply #1 on: December 29, 2017, 01:18:24 pm »

The main problem you can run into with bullet diameter is being able to chamber the rounds. Unfortunately, there is little consistency from various manufacturers in their chamber dimensions.  My recommendation is to order different bullet sizing dies, .431, .430, .429, and even .428. I use Winchester brass exclusively because it has the thinnest walls, and gives you a bit more leeway in bullet size. Starline is a bit thicker. Remington is too thick in the walls, IMHO.  Since you are going to be using BP and soft bullets you may be able to get away with smaller bullets, as they will tend to "bump up". But you will have to see what works best for you. Don't forget to use a firm but not excessive roll crimp of the case mouth into the crimp groove or the top grease groove. With BP, of course, you don't need to worry about the bullet backing into the case. But you still should have a firm crimp to retard shotstart until the BP starts burning properly.
Best of luck, and Happy New Year!
Logged

Ride to the sound of the guns, but watch out for bushwhackers! Godspeed to all in harm's way in the defense of Freedom! God Bless America!

Your obedient servant,
Trailrider,
Bvt. Lt. Col. Commanding,
Southern District
Dept. of the Platte, GAF
Coal Creek Griff
Top Active Citizen
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1469



« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2017, 01:40:11 pm »

In my Uberti 1873 rifle, the largest bullet that I can easily get to chamber is .429.  I use the same mold that you're looking at and it's excellent. I've had good results with the same (smokeless) load in all four of my rifles and in my Pietta revolver.

CC Griff
Logged

Manager, WT Ranch--Coal Creek Division

BOLD #921
BOSS #196
1860 Henry Rifle Shooter #173
SSS #573
Cliff Fendley
NCOWS
Top Active Citizen
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 3101



« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2017, 02:01:17 pm »

I've never had any trouble with .430 chambering in any of my guns, even the old ones with .427 bores. That said I run .429 bullets in all of mine. I use Starline brass mostly and use RCBS cowboy sizing dies and Lee FCD.

I have that same 215C mold. I can't remember what I told Tom when I ordered it other than I planned on sizing at .429 and what allow I would be using. I have sized a few down to .427 for some original Winchesters.
Logged

http://www.fendleyknives.com/

NCOWS 3345  RATS 576 NRA Life member

Johnson County Rangers
Yeso Bill
Very Active Citizen
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 59


« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2017, 08:23:23 pm »

Several years ago w44wcf (John Kort) advised me to order the 43-215 C in a .432 and he recommended an alloy of 10 lbs. of wheel weights and 5 lbs. of lead.  I still have some of those bullets and they measure .432 in that alloy.  The 215 C is an awful good bullet and mine will average 220 grains.   

Early in the year I ordered the 43-230 E and the 43-245 C in a .432 and they drop .4325 - .433” with alloys 1:20 – 1:30.  The heavy end of the 43- 230s in 1:30 will weigh out at 240 grains and 245 C will go over 251.

Like Cliff, I have sizers from .427 – 431 and I haven’t noticed a big difference in accuracy concerning bullet alloys or size.   

My Uberti barrels (6) all measure .430” and I am shooting .430s at the present time.  I have shot .431s with no chambering problems. 

I carry a 44-40 daily while making my ranch rounds and the 230 bullet has replaced the 215 C.  Having said that, I’ll add that it isn’t a magic bullet as I passed on a 125 + yard shot at a big ol’ coyote a few hours ago because of the wind.

I don’t worry too much about the accuracy of my pistols.  I develop the best load for a rifle and figure it will shoot “good enough” out of a pistol at pistol ranges.

Billy 
Logged
Cliff Fendley
NCOWS
Top Active Citizen
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 3101



« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2017, 10:43:13 pm »

I'll have to measure my 215C as they drop from 1:20 next time I pour some. I honestly don't believe I ever checked them I just size them to .429 and roll with it.
Logged

http://www.fendleyknives.com/

NCOWS 3345  RATS 576 NRA Life member

Johnson County Rangers
Yeso Bill
Very Active Citizen
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 59


« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2017, 02:27:14 pm »

Cliff:  Since I got on this 300 M “pig kick”, I weigh and sort all my bullets.  I cast out of a 20 lb. Lee pot with a dipper.  Whether they need it or not, I’ll cull 10% of the light end and put the rest in order in a labeled small utility Dillon box.  https://www.dillonprecision.com/dillon-utility-boxes-small_8_10_24018.html
That way, when I load a small batch, I know the bullets are within 1/10th of a grain and can't blame a flier on " a bad bullet". 
 
I didn’t say above but when I was shooting the 215 bullet, I was using Swiss II but was not shooting over 100 yards.  When I went to 300 meters and the heavier bullets I tried Swiss III and O.E. III in order to raise the velocity.  To my surprise, the groups with O.E. were almost half of what the Swiss were. So.....
 
Capnball:  Certainly try O.E. II with the 215 and let us know the results.
 
Billy 
Logged
Little Dalton
Top Active Citizen
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 103


-ad regem-


WWW
« Reply #7 on: December 31, 2017, 12:14:48 am »

As usual, y'all did not disappoint. MANY thanks for all the input. I believe I will order the mold for .432 in soft lead (soft shrinks the most) just to be safe, and a .430 sizing die to start. What is y'all's preferred lubing/sizing tool/system for BP .44WCF? I was pan lubing with homemade lube my .45 PRS boolits, and sizing in a Lyman 450 that needs new seals. I have considered the Lee sizing kit. What are y'all's recommendations?
Logged

Jordan Goodwin

Blacksmithing, woodworking, history nut, entrepreneur, and work at home.

Hand forged gun hooks over on the website:
www.axe-and-anvil.com

"Blessed be the Lord my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight." (Ps. 144:1)

Reckon so.
Yeso Bill
Very Active Citizen
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 59


« Reply #8 on: December 31, 2017, 01:08:31 am »

I have used an RCBS Lubeamatic since the 1970s.  It has always leaked.  Cry

You can't go wrong with SPG although I have some DGL on order that I have never tried.  Recipes are all over the place and many mix their own.  I always figured that I had enough to do without making the lube also.

Billy
Logged
Roscoe
Top Active Citizen
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 103


« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2018, 08:31:42 am »

My 1875 Remington Outlaw by Uberti is sized the same as 44 Special, so I set the 44WCF bullets (.428) aside and just use my .430 bullets. Don't have the rifle.
Logged
David Battersby
Active citizen
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 37


Smokeless powder is a passing fad .


« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2018, 11:12:22 am »

   I always figured that I had enough to do without making the lube also.

Billy
[/quote]

Amen brother!   Time is precious and I don't have enough as it is.   
Also, I think that you will like DGL.  I use it in the 44WCF in a 24" barreled rifle with Swiss 2F and a 427098 style bullet from an Accurate Mold. So far I have gone 125 shots without cleaning and no loss of accuracy.

The bullets sized to. 4305 chamber in my 1873 UbertiChester Rifle and 1858 Uberti/Remington Revolver  just fine
Logged

John Moses Browning and Teddy Roosevelt, we need you again !
In the days of old when men were bold and a quarter was still worth a dime.
Yeso Bill
Very Active Citizen
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 59


« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2018, 12:39:31 am »

Thanks David.
      If I can go just 10% of your figure, I'll be happy. 
The humidity gauge here is stuck on 16.

Billy
Logged
Pages: [1] Go Up Print 
Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  CAS TOPICS  |  The Powder Room - CAS reloading (Moderator: Professor Marvel)  |  Topic: .44-40 revolver/rifle sizing « previous next »
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.054 seconds with 22 queries.