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Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  CAS TOPICS  |  The Leather Shop (Moderators: Marshal Will Wingam, Ten Wolves Fiveshooter)  |  Topic: Half breed style holsters/ belts 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: Half breed style holsters/ belts  (Read 1148 times)
Charley Waite
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« on: November 14, 2017, 09:52:12 am »


So far i think my favorite look for a holster/ belt combo is the half breed style holsters. Coincidentally similar to the style the duke was known for.  My question is how historically accurate are these holsters/ belts? Is it a hollywood reel cowboy thing or were they actually prevalent? If so during what time period?  Still not sure about the canvas/ leather belt vs all leather. The two belts im currently looking at (after trying other styles via loan to make sure) are the duke holster/ belt combo and the westerner combo. Both from cochise leather.

Thanks for any help pards.
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St. George
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« Reply #1 on: November 14, 2017, 11:08:33 am »

He didn't wear a 'Half-Breed' rig - more of an 1890's skirtless style with a money belt - or even what El Paso Saddlery calls the '1930 Austin'.

His costuming came from his personal wants and desires - not from the pages of history - so don't mistake the 'John Ford Reference Library' for an actual reference.

The 'Half-Breed' holster was a spring-retained shoulder holster and not that leather cartoon worn in 'Tombstone', either.

It was worn vertically - under the armpit and with a cross-chest retaining strap - the spring holding the cylinder, with a cupped toe containing the muzzle.

If you want to know what was actually worn and when, get a copy of 'Packing Iron', by Rattenbury - it's what has turned into the model for modern holster makers replicating the era.

Scouts Out!
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Charley Waite
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« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2017, 11:15:41 am »

He didn't wear a 'Half-Breed' rig - more of an 1890's skirtless style with a money belt - or even what El Paso Saddlery calls the '1930 Austin'.

His costuming came from his personal wants and desires - not from the pages of history - so don't mistake the 'John Ford Reference Library' for an actual reference.

The 'Half-Breed' holster was a spring-retained shoulder holster and not that leather cartoon worn in 'Tombstone', either.

It was worn vertically - under the armpit and with a cross-chest retaining strap - the spring holding the cylinder, with a cupped toe containing the muzzle.

If you want to know what was actually worn and when, get a copy of 'Packing Iron', by Rattenbury - it's what has turned into the model for modern holster makers replicating the era.

Scouts Out!

Thanks! Im starting to realize i need to pick a copy of that up...
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St. George
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« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2017, 11:27:50 am »

Yup...

Look on 'Amazon' and also on 'ebay' - prices can vary.

And in your quest - look in the 'back issues' of the 'Historical Society' and NCOWS' forums, too - all of your period dress answers are somewhere in there.

Go to your Public Library and start reading the Time-Life series 'The Old West' - it'll help.

Don't open your wallet until you've opened some pages so you can make yourself smart.

Scouts Out!
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« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2017, 12:10:51 pm »

My favorite source for used books. You are free to contact the seller, he's already paid his fees to list the book;

https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?ds=20&kn=packing+iron+rattenbury&sts=t
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« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2017, 06:11:00 pm »

The term 'half-breed' refers to a type of holster with a single loop but with a skirt that isn't visible from the front. Heiser and other makers produced them from the early years of the 20th century. They were not seen in the Old West.

But I see in PI that the term also refers to a type of shoulder holster patented by F. R. Lewis of Reno, Nevada in 1911.
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Marshal Will Wingam
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« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2017, 06:37:11 pm »

I've thought the half-breed holster is as Skeeter described. Somewhere between a skirted holster and a Slim Jim. If that's what you're asking about, to my knowledge they are a 20 century design.
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Charley Waite
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« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2017, 09:33:50 pm »

Dang. Alright. Good to know that it wouldnt be period correct for what im going for. Im just nit a fan of so much excess material like ive seen on the majority of holsters. It just looks....odd to my eyes. There is always a slim jim, but idk how many would have used one with an 1873 SAA......guess i could always shoot cartridge conversion open tops...
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Marshal Will Wingam
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« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2017, 11:47:17 pm »

Maybe it'll help you to cruise through our thread on different styles and variations for ideas here.
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Charley Waite
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« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2017, 12:36:41 am »

Maybe it'll help you to cruise through our thread on different styles and variations for ideas here.

Thanks pard. Was lookin for a thread like that.
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Skeeter Lewis
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« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2017, 05:24:02 am »

Colt SAAs were certainly packed in slim jims in the 1870s before Mexican loops became the norm.
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Johnny McCrae
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« Reply #11 on: November 16, 2017, 08:21:08 am »

Howdy Charlie,

Open Range is one of my favorite movies so you got my curiosity up. Don't know if this will help but I found the attached picture and the websites below.
https://www.google.com/search?q=open+range+movie+images&rlz=1C1SQJL_enUS767US767&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjBwNDRlcPXAhWDWSYKHTf2AOEQ7AkIRw&biw=1536&bih=734#imgrc=C1DMh_XjbgVdMM:

https://www.google.com/search?q=open+range+movie+images&tbm=isch&tbs=rimg:CWqyfJHv59kEIjh1ocLvj5uLG1uDV8SRaWU_12DgfHUvyMiHrGa7C8v_1idATsYoHj95CJz6NTDUCEJVPercl7ac49fyoSCXWhwu-Pm4sbESthAPoDvRV2KhIJW4NXxJFpZT8RHE9B1imbjlQqEgnYOB8dS_1IyIREybxknWSY58SoSCesZrsLy_1-J0Eel-bmF1LG1eKhIJBOxigeP3kIkRD_18fALsk1JYqEgnPo1MNQIQlUxHnX0cmcZj6wSoSCd6tyXtpzj1_1EQ_1V0UCxVtJr&tbo=u&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi0xJiim8PXAhXF7oMKHdBsCZIQ9C8IHw&biw=1536&bih=734&dpr=1.25#imgrc=arJ8ke_n2QQhwM:

The above websites have pretty decent pictures of Boss Spearman's and Charley Waite's Holsters.


* OR1.jpg (80.53 KB, 1200x773 - viewed 64 times.)
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« Reply #12 on: November 16, 2017, 12:15:09 pm »

Just to add to this thread;

http://www.purdygear.com/SAhalfbreed.html

P.S. I like the idea of a rough-out moneybelt.
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Charley Waite
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« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2017, 04:24:36 am »


Thanks. Cochise makes a good version of the Charlie rig, however Im not the biggest fan of the excess material around the holster (but period correct is period correct...), which is why I like the halfbreed and slim jim style so much.
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Charley Waite
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« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2017, 04:35:25 am »

Holsters/ belts along this style catch my eye. http://www.cochiseleather.com/western-gun-belt-hs1885.aspx
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Marshal Will Wingam
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« Reply #15 on: November 17, 2017, 01:11:44 pm »

I've found I like the Slimjim holsters best for actual wear. They cant out slightly further than a Mexican loop and are easier to drop your pistol into when on a CAS stage. I do find that a tie-down strap helps even though it isn't historically correct. For an actual open carry holster, I like them better without the tie-down. The pics are of my left holster. I don't have any good ones of my right side one.


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* MailOrder02sm.JPG (59.53 KB, 638x480 - viewed 30 times.)

* MailOrder04sm.JPG (66.39 KB, 640x481 - viewed 34 times.)
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Marshal Will Wingam
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« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2017, 01:16:00 pm »

Here's the complete rig, tie-downs and all.


* Outlaw Rig Sm.JPG (69.31 KB, 640x480 - viewed 46 times.)
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« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2017, 08:17:18 pm »

Will, beautiful work, the Slimjim, has been one of my favorites also, and for the same reasons as you...

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« Reply #18 on: November 18, 2017, 06:20:50 am »

Quote
Will, beautiful work, the Slimjim, has been one of my favorites also, and for the same reasons as you...
My sentiments exactly.

Attached is a picture of the Rig I've been using for many years.


* jvsrig.JPG (86.25 KB, 600x450 - viewed 47 times.)
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« Reply #19 on: November 18, 2017, 10:45:03 am »

Holsters/ belts along this style catch my eye. http://www.cochiseleather.com/western-gun-belt-hs1885.aspx

Charlie that is a more modern design, not just the skirt but the low hanging long loop, and you'll also be pressed to find any historical copy of a crossdraw holster like that. The holsters you see worn in a cross draw cant in historical photographs were straight cut hang holsters that are worn canted slightly. Some of my personal patterns are traced copies of original mexican loop holsters and they allow to be worn strong side or cross draw.

As Will referenced a later Slim Jim holster my fit better to the look you want and be historically accurate.
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Marshal Will Wingam
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« Reply #20 on: November 21, 2017, 12:05:53 am »

Thanks, TW, Johnny.

Nice rig, Johnny.

Cliff, You certainly do have some good patterns. Cool to have them traced from originals.
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Major 2
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« Reply #21 on: November 21, 2017, 01:20:54 am »

 Miller-Fechet holster
the Miller-Fachet holster was a non-regulation style designed by Capt. Fachet, Co. G 8th Cavalry.
Circa 1888 ... saw use in Cuba

Or a Southwest influence , this one by Johnny McCrae


* P1000200.JPG (55.74 KB, 480x320 - viewed 27 times.)

* D Holster 1.JPG (123.27 KB, 358x631 - viewed 27 times.)
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Johnny McCrae
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« Reply #22 on: November 21, 2017, 06:42:13 am »

The Holster Major posted is a copy I made of a Holster that was given to me by Ten Wolves. I proudly display my 1851 Navy in it.

Worth mentioning again is the unique tab on the pouch that keeps the pouch from slipping in the skirt.


* 1851 Navy TW.jpg (126.75 KB, 800x996 - viewed 33 times.)

* ds3.jpg (106.12 KB, 695x736 - viewed 31 times.)
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Marshal Will Wingam
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« Reply #23 on: November 21, 2017, 05:48:25 pm »

Major, Johnny, that's a very cool holster. I really like that tab on the pouch.
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« Reply #24 on: November 21, 2017, 06:34:13 pm »

Major, Johnny, that's a very cool holster. I really like that tab on the pouch.

Dont know where the rules are on holsters - do know some of the designs so far need a LOT of good hide - heres three just plain jane workin holsters I made - my guns live in them (in the safe) but I make a "sock" from cotton flannelette - soak the sock in 30grade engine oil - then dry the sock off enough the oil wont bleed out - put the sock on for storage - nothing rusts . 
(picture is a little blurry at magnification - took it inside with no flash)


* holsters.jpeg (100.14 KB, 800x480 - viewed 35 times.)
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Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  CAS TOPICS  |  The Leather Shop (Moderators: Marshal Will Wingam, Ten Wolves Fiveshooter)  |  Topic: Half breed style holsters/ belts « previous next »
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