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Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  Special Interests - Groups & Societies  |  STORM (Moderators: RRio, Major 2)  |  Topic: Yippee! Type II Richards coming my way! 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: Yippee! Type II Richards coming my way!  (Read 3066 times)
Tuolumne Lawman
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« Reply #25 on: August 28, 2017, 09:49:20 pm »

WOW!!  Grin. You have an indoor that allows BP ??  Shocked    Way KOOL!!   Cool

Hahaha  No, they don't.  I am shooting smokeless tomorrow.  I'll have to go up into the woods to shot BP, though all I have is Triple 7 at the moment.
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TUOLUMNE LAWMAN
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« Reply #26 on: August 29, 2017, 02:39:38 pm »

Here she is.  I made up the box from a 45 Schofield Cheyenne Cartridge box and a label (from the batch I was emailing).  The .44 Colt rounds are originals from my collection, just for pictures.  

The carved Slim Jim is from a small shop called Possum Creek Leather.  It is copied from "Packing Iron" and is made specifically for the 1869 Richards Type II.  His info is: <daveh@catt.com>.  He does them custom, and it is not his full time business  The holster is gorgeous! 

He has some on Ebay right now: https://www.ebay.com/sch/daveh72hs/m.html?item=162620862137&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2562

Looks great, look forward to the range report.  Smiley
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« Reply #27 on: August 29, 2017, 09:27:48 pm »

Wow, it shoots high!  About 6-8" above POA at 7 yards.  Also my Open Tops did not mind the 7.0 of Trail Boss, but the Type II didn't like it.  I'll reload down to 6.0 and try again.  Also, I need to either replace the front sight with a taller one, or bob the nose of the hammer and recut the sight notch - thus "lowering" the rear sight.
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TUOLUMNE LAWMAN
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« Reply #28 on: August 29, 2017, 11:50:58 pm »

Looking at it at home, I think part of the problem is that the rear sight notch on the nose of the hammer is so tiny (it was barely a scratch on the nose of the hammer!), I was actually bringing the front sight up above it to see it, therefore shooting too high.  I took a triangular file. and cut a deep, generous notch in it, where the front sight is plainly visible without having to raise it above the rear sight.  I am betting this will drop it down to POI about 3" above POA, or a 6 o'clock hold, which is my preferred POA/POI combo. I call it my "pop can hold" because if you are shooting at cans, and you visually set the can on top of the front sight, you hit the center!  I will try it with some fresh loads with 6.0 grains Trail Boss next time I go.
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TUOLUMNE LAWMAN
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« Reply #29 on: August 30, 2017, 06:29:28 am »

Had to do the same thing to the rear sight on my conversion 1860 plus make the front sight higher and it still shoots high because I reduced the load using Trail Boss, lighter the load the higher it shoots.
If I remember right they used to say aim for the belt buckle hit em in the chest.
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« Reply #30 on: September 04, 2017, 08:26:40 pm »

Update, I took a triangular file and opened up the rear sight notch on the hammer, so I can get a real sight picture, without raising the front sight above the nose of the hammer.  Taking it to the range tomorrow to see if it helps.
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TUOLUMNE LAWMAN
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« Reply #31 on: September 05, 2017, 02:35:13 pm »

Range report -  What a difference.  10 shots at  7 yards basic group 1.5" with one flyer to 2 1/4".  Much better sight acquisition, too.  Point of imp[act was about 2-3 inches above point of aim.  Perfect.  I did not realize the difference on point of impact by having to raise the front sight slightly above the nose of the hammer would make.  Wow.  I am in love. 

I think dropping from 6.5 grains of trail boss to 5.9 to 6.0 made a noticeable difference in group size.
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TUOLUMNE LAWMAN
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« Reply #32 on: September 05, 2017, 03:24:16 pm »

Hahaha  No, they don't.  I am shooting smokeless tomorrow.  I'll have to go up into the woods to shot BP, though all I have is Triple 7 at the moment.

What!? No belch and smoke in an open top?

That's just wrong. Sad
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Coffinmaker
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« Reply #33 on: September 05, 2017, 09:13:48 pm »


Too KOOL!!  My last step when sitting up a pair of Open Top Cap Guns is to open up the sight on the hammer so I can actually SEE the front sight.  Glad to see it coming together!!
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Pitchy
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« Reply #34 on: September 06, 2017, 06:47:14 am »

Haven`t got around to opening up mine yet been too busy cutting wood.
What weight bullet are you using, I`m loading a 230 grain lead over 4.8 grains of Trail Boss but it`s plenty light and raised the point of impact about three inch.
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« Reply #35 on: September 06, 2017, 09:23:06 am »

Haven`t got around to opening up mine yet been too busy cutting wood.
What weight bullet are you using, I`m loading a 230 grain lead over 4.8 grains of Trail Boss but it`s plenty light and raised the point of impact about three inch.

I'm using a Stateline Bullet Company 200 grain RNFP over 5.9 to 6 grains of Trail Boss.  A noticeable difference in recoil from the 7 grains I was using!
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TUOLUMNE LAWMAN
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« Reply #36 on: September 06, 2017, 11:59:13 am »

I'm using a Stateline Bullet Company 200 grain RNFP over 5.9 to 6 grains of Trail Boss.  A noticeable difference in recoil from the 7 grains I was using!

Yepper, guess I`m probably about right with my load and a heavier bullet then, just gotta get the sight dialed in now.  Smiley
Thanks.
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« Reply #37 on: September 07, 2017, 01:06:56 pm »

Yepper, guess I`m probably about right with my load and a heavier bullet then, just gotta get the sight dialed in now.  Smiley
Thanks.

Heavier bullet prints higher. To lower the POI try a lighter bullet like some of the Big-Lube offerings.
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NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
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« Reply #38 on: September 07, 2017, 01:38:29 pm »

Heavier bullet prints higher. To lower the POI try a lighter bullet like some of the Big-Lube offerings.

Yep, I have a mold for the 230 so I`ll stick with it with a lighter charge.  Smiley
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« Reply #39 on: September 20, 2017, 07:22:00 pm »

Tuolumne,

I just came across a 2016 posting, where the poster stated that the conversion ring on the Richard's Type II he received had an integrally molded conversion ring to the frame rather than being a separte part like the originals.

What is the new Richard's that you received like, along these lines?

Thanks for the updated info.
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Black River Smith
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« Reply #40 on: September 20, 2017, 11:32:02 pm »

Black River Smith, I believe that guy was mistaken.  I've seen many new Type II's since then, including very recently, all with a separate piece for the conversion ring.
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Black River Smith
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« Reply #41 on: September 21, 2017, 09:12:46 am »

Abilene,

Thank you.  Glad to hear that they are still keeping to traditional designs to a point.
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Black River Smith
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« Reply #42 on: September 21, 2017, 10:12:44 am »

Of course, I never saw the "1-piece" frame that was mentioned.  Perhaps it was a prototype that somehow escaped Uberti?  I doubt it, but crazy things happen.
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Coal Creek Griff
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« Reply #43 on: September 21, 2017, 10:36:24 am »

I thought that mine might be one piece, but very close inspection revealed that it was two pieces very closely mated.

CC Griff
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« Reply #44 on: September 21, 2017, 04:59:07 pm »

Mine is two piece, just like the originals.
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TUOLUMNE LAWMAN
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« Reply #45 on: September 22, 2017, 06:01:25 pm »

Heavier bullet prints higher. To lower the POI try a lighter bullet like some of the Big-Lube offerings.

Pitchy, you missed the point. In all cases heavier bullets from pistols strike higher at normal pistol ranges. Heavier bullets are affected more by increasing the recoil of the pistol by raising the angle of departure more.

By changing only the powder charge, the greater speed allows the bullet to leave the barrel earlier before recoil raises the muzzle enough to change the POI. Reducing the charge, reduces recoil, but also lengthening the time in bore thus allowing it to leave at a higher angle

I have tested this in my own shooting. It might not sound quite right, but do try it out. My reommendation is to go to a 200grain bullet
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NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”
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« Reply #46 on: September 22, 2017, 06:57:29 pm »

Pitchy, you missed the point. In all cases heavier bullets from pistols strike higher at normal pistol ranges. Heavier bullets are affected more by increasing the recoil of the pistol by raising the angle of departure more.

By changing only the powder charge, the greater speed allows the bullet to leave the barrel earlier before recoil raises the muzzle enough to change the POI.

I have tested this in my own shooting. It might not sound quite right, but do try it out. My reommendation is to go to a 200grain bullet

Not at all I agree completely and replied that I have a mold for the 230 grain bullet so will stick with it and change the sight.
Yepper have known that for years and have verified it also.  Smiley
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« Reply #47 on: September 22, 2017, 07:16:31 pm »

Mabe I missed the point? I understood you to say the POI with your 230 grainers was still too high?
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NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”
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« Reply #48 on: September 22, 2017, 07:30:29 pm »

Sorry I must of not been clear, I started out using a higher charge and it shot poa  but I didn`t care for the recoil so dropped the charge and it shot high.
So I decided instead of going to a lighter bullet too raise the front sight which I did then it shot poa again.
Here`s the poat about the sight.

http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,59983.25.html
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« Reply #49 on: October 07, 2017, 11:39:58 pm »

Shot the Richards Type II in a match today.  Shot clean with it, though I dropped a few with the Schofield.  The caveat there is that I was shooting at the rifle targets with the pistols for  10 point bonus!  If I shot the pistol targets, there would be no misses. Wow, this 8" Richards points REALLY nice!  I am in LOVE! Roll Eyes
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TUOLUMNE LAWMAN
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