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Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  CAS TOPICS  |  1911 & Wild Bunch Shooting (Moderators: Jefro, August)  |  Topic: Shooting your 1911 in Wild Bunch 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
Poll
Question: How do you shoot your 1911 in Wild Bunch?
Duelist - 9 (64.3%)
Two hands - 5 (35.7%)
Total Voters: 14

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Author Topic: Shooting your 1911 in Wild Bunch  (Read 5573 times)
Baltimore Ed
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« on: May 21, 2017, 02:58:31 pm »


Hey guys, I don't know if this has been asked before as a poll. How do you shoot your 1911, duelist or modern? Simple question. I won't get into the WB esthetics of modern vs traditional 1911s. There are those who think 1911/1911A1 style are the only correct 1911s to use in a shooting sport that is based on the classic movie The Wild Bunch. And there are those who don't see a problem. That decision has been made by the powers that created WB. No need to beat that horse. So, how do you operate whichever 1911 that you use?
'Give'em hell, Pike'.
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Coffinmaker
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« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2017, 11:33:47 am »

Harumpff!! 

Gunfighter.  1911 in each hand.  Well ...... right up until SASS stuck their collective noses into it.

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Blackfoot
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« Reply #2 on: May 23, 2017, 06:46:21 am »

You will probably get a better idea of the modern/traditional ratio by checking the results of a major Wild Bunch match.  Winter Range 2017 scores be a good one to look at.  

Blackfoot

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Baltimore Ed
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« Reply #3 on: May 23, 2017, 08:36:05 am »

My wife and I are possibly going down to Florida later this year to visit my best friend who recently retired there so I started looking for WB matches that I could attend and plan my trip around. One came up on the web at a large range/club in central Florida but upon emailing I was told that it had been cancelled a year ago due to poor attendance. I've been told a large Raleigh club has had to combine the dedicated WB into the monthly match due to lack of interest. My club will shoot our WB match this weekend but cowboys will also be able to shoot too. I'm just curious, has WB run it's course? I hope not. This was part of my thinking in starting this poll in Cas City. I was also curious about duelist vs modern and would the ratio be the same as a cowboy match. There is a broad range of interests, shooters and firearms represented in this forum so a poll here might be informative. I will look at Winter Range and post what I find there.
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PJ Hardtack
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« Reply #4 on: May 23, 2017, 10:43:49 am »

I came into CAS as an IPSC burn out, so I was a two fisted six gunner at first.  I was told that "the best of the best" shot with one hand. Eventually I came to believe in shooting with one paw, like all the western movie heroes.

When 'Wild Bunch' came along, it only made sense to shoot in the style of the era, with one hand.

At a SASS Champ match in Canada, I met a petite lady who shot her 1911 and six guns quite well with one hand. I asked her why that choice. She told me she had a shoulder problem that precluded the use of both hands with a handgun, but allowed her to shoot long guns.
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Coffinmaker
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« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2017, 12:13:54 pm »

In and around my Theater of Operations ..... Wild Bunch is all but dead.  Not enough Wild Bunch to shoot a dedicated WB match.  ALL the clubs I a three state radius have had to combine WB with Cowboy.  I don't hold long term hope for the health of WB.

I could/would wax long and loud my opine why, but I've probably beat that horse to death.  Best bet is to return WB to a side match type thing, just as it started out.

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PJ Hardtack
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« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2017, 03:17:18 pm »

I didn't realize that WB had ever been anything other than a side match.

I don't see anything wrong with a WB match if there are enough people with the guns who want to shoot it. I only know TWO for real Cowboys (one rancher, t'other a retired calf roper), both who shoot SAA .45s  "Gunfighter", one with 7.5" guns and a Spencer carbine in 56-50. The Spencer kills his time but he couldn't care less.

The gun was an anniversary present from his wife who made a call to Italy and talked to the head honcho to place the order. He was so touched by the romance of it, he expedited the sale personally.

Not everyone is an urban Cowboy, but all kinds of folks were involved in the Mexican Revolution. It's the only aspect of SASS with anything resembling a power factor.
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« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2017, 07:35:17 pm »

My wife and I are possibly going down to Florida later this year to visit my best friend who recently retired there so I started looking for WB matches that I could attend and plan my trip around. One came up on the web at a large range/club in central Florida but upon emailing I was told that it had been cancelled a year ago due to poor attendance. I've been told a large Raleigh club has had to combine the dedicated WB into the monthly match due to lack of interest. My club will shoot our WB match this weekend but cowboys will also be able to shoot too. I'm just curious, has WB run it's course? I hope not. This was part of my thinking in starting this poll in Cas City. I was also curious about duelist vs modern and would the ratio be the same as a cowboy match. There is a broad range of interests, shooters and firearms represented in this forum so a poll here might be informative. I will look at Winter Range and post what I find there.

I belong to that club.... the lack of interest part was not lack of interest ....was actually too much immersion

You see the poor attendance was the by product of  TOO MANY SASS events.... there is SASS match Sat. and/or Sun. every weekend
with a 275 mile circle ....

Wild Bunch, Western 3 Gun, and NCOWs suffered for shooters....  3 gun died 8 years ago ,
Wild Bunch & NCOWs still has a following but seldom can muster 8 shooters to man a match  Sad

 
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PJ Hardtack
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« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2017, 10:36:48 am »

A victim of it's own success?

We got to that point here now. For years we struggled to get CAS established north and south of us.  We succeeded to the point where there is now a flood of events on the calendar and you have to pick and choose which events you can attend.

One year we went to five events, some of them back to back, and it was too much. The summer was gone to the neglect of other things that got left undone. In the end, it wasn't fun, just a lot of work.

We enjoy shooting IDPA, so it gets to the point where something has to go.
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« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2017, 11:00:42 am »

To many rules. Shoothing should be safe and fun.
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PJ Hardtack
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« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2017, 10:11:08 am »

What rules would you see eliminated?
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« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2017, 12:50:18 pm »

Use a period shotgun. Remington model 10, double barrel, auto 5 all these shotguns were around before the 1911. Why the just the 97? Rifle caliber restriction .40 cal or larger. One should be allowed the 1905 or 1907 Winchester self loaders. Some of us already own some of these weapons and don't need the added expense of a new shotgun or rifle. Just my 5 cents worth.
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« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2017, 01:01:14 pm »

Use a period shotgun. Remington model 10, double barrel, auto 5 all these shotguns were around before the 1911. Why the just the 97? Rifle caliber restriction .40 cal or larger. One should be allowed the 1905 or 1907 Winchester self loaders. Some of us already own some of these weapons and don't need the added expense of a new shotgun or rifle. Just my 5 cents worth.
Galen, Check out AZSA
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« Reply #13 on: May 25, 2017, 01:52:57 pm »

Hey guys, I don't know if this has been asked before as a poll. How do you shoot your 1911, duelist or modern? Simple question. I won't get into the WB esthetics of modern vs traditional 1911s. There are those who think 1911/1911A1 style are the only correct 1911s to use in a shooting sport that is based on the classic movie The Wild Bunch. And there are those who don't see a problem. That decision has been made by the powers that created WB. No need to beat that horse. So, how do you operate whichever 1911 that you use?
'Give'em hell, Pike'.

My WB 1911 is the Cimarron by Armscor.  As it is a 1911 frame, not the A1, it just seems "right" to shoot it one-handed.  But besides that, it is the most natural pointing gun that I own for shooting one-handed.

Around central Texas, there are still a fair amount of Wild Bunch matches.  Not a huge number of shooters, but at least it is still around.  My schedule hasn't allowed me to shoot it too often.  You can tell how serious I am about it by the fact that I still do not own any mag pouches.  I used cheesy clip-on cell-phone holders from the dollar store a couple times, and vest pockets when it isn't too hot for a vest.
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Baltimore Ed
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« Reply #14 on: May 25, 2017, 03:25:39 pm »

Abilene, my WB rig has always been a nice original 1911 GI flap holster or a repro cavalry swivel holster (with the tie down strap) worn  on a mills web belt and mills GI flap mag pouches. If I'm in my Pike outfit I wear the waist holster but if I'm in my Punitive Expedition outfit I wear the swivel holster. The ultimate advantage of duelist 1911 over modern IMHO is that after you rack the slide your offhand is grabbing a mag so that when you finish shooting and drop the mty mag you're loading a freash one. There isn't that looong wait that modern shooters often experience. This of course assumes that your gun is running ok and not having problems that require your weak hand to correct. Also, as you don't return the mty gun to the holster on the clock the flap is of little consequence but I do tuck the mag pouches flaps out of the way.


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Dusty Boddams
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« Reply #15 on: May 25, 2017, 10:27:31 pm »

 Grin odd thing. Here in north Texas wild bunch is alive and well. It's shot every month 8-12 competitors. Oklahoma city its growing they have 15-20 shooters at there WB match monthly and they also have a 1911/bamm on the fourth weekend with good turnout. I mainly shoot modern but a few times a year will shoot traditional class just to keep things interesting. As a matter of fact the Oklahoma state WB match will be happening June 10 weekend and they will have 25-35 competitors.  In this area  wild bunch is doing well and we are having a large time! Dusty Boddams
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« Reply #16 on: May 26, 2017, 11:49:14 am »

Here in Arizona, Wild Bunch is popular.  We have dedicated, monthly Wild Bunch matches in several places in the State.  Recently, we've seen new people showing up who cannot resist running their 1911 and M-12/M-97 just as fast as their skills allow.  And, of course, the National Wild Bunch Championship is held here.  The National Match has grown consistently over the past few years.  Heck, it has gotten very competitive as a matter of fact.

I guess if one is not happy with the state of Wild Bunch in their region, they ought to step up and promote it. 
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PJ Hardtack
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« Reply #17 on: May 27, 2017, 01:50:05 pm »

I'm with you on all of the guns you mentioned - but, the 'Wild Bunch' event is based on the movie.

Going "Rogue" or "Outlaw" to admit all firearms of the Mexican Revolution era might be the next logical way to go.


Use a period shotgun. Remington model 10, double barrel, auto 5 all these shotguns were around before the 1911. Why the just the 97? Rifle caliber restriction .40 cal or larger. One should be allowed the 1905 or 1907 Winchester self loaders. Some of us already own some of these weapons and don't need the added expense of a new shotgun or rifle. Just my 5 cents worth.
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« Reply #18 on: May 27, 2017, 05:58:24 pm »

William Holden carried his 1911 in a 1942 tanker holster. Period authentic?
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Baltimore Ed
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« Reply #19 on: May 27, 2017, 06:51:10 pm »

But it was hidden under his vest.
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« Reply #20 on: May 27, 2017, 07:23:32 pm »

The holster wasn't hidden very well.
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PJ Hardtack
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« Reply #21 on: May 28, 2017, 08:44:49 pm »

The holster wasn't hidden very well.

... but nothing says a period correct shoulder rig couldn't have existed ....
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I don't do these things to others and I require the same from them."  John Wayne
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« Reply #22 on: May 28, 2017, 10:18:39 pm »

A 1942 shoulder holster is ok but don't bring a lever gun under 40 caliber.
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Baltimore Ed
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« Reply #23 on: May 29, 2017, 09:39:11 am »

Another tidbit about Pike's outfit is that his silver lieutenant bars on his epaulettes are actually Air Force bars not Army. Peckinpah wanted some kind of insignia for Pike so that's what the prop dept came up with.
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« Reply #24 on: May 29, 2017, 04:56:00 pm »

I watched that movie several times and missed a lot of these details. I get too hung up on the story line.

My seamstress wife looks for zippers and Velcro on period dresses in period movies. Finds a few.
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"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on.
I don't do these things to others and I require the same from them."  John Wayne
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