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Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  Special Interests - Groups & Societies  |  The Winchester Model 1873 (Moderator: Major 2)  |  Topic: Uberti 1873 carbine .44-40 factory anmo 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: Uberti 1873 carbine .44-40 factory anmo  (Read 1624 times)
Doug.38PR
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« on: March 20, 2017, 09:54:34 am »


I ordered a .44-40 uberti 1873 carbine.  Will this factory ammo function and is it safe for said gun?  (I would think so due to it being what the gun was designed for and from previous conversations, i would think so.)

Just trying to do all my homework

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/530044/winchester-super-x-ammunition-44-40-wcf-200-grain-soft-point-box-of-50
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Coal Creek Griff
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« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2017, 10:34:46 am »

Yes.

CC Griff
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Coffinmaker
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« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2017, 01:01:13 pm »

Absolutely Adrian!!  (quote a famous movie line)

Coffinmaker
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Marshal Deadwood
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« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2017, 03:10:46 pm »

But watch which factory ammo you use !

http://s276.photobucket.com/user/michaeltoniclemons/media/16296149_10210546327848764_2007836732_n_zps9ufguju2.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0
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Doug.38PR
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« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2017, 03:22:03 pm »

I had just heard thst uberi chambers were tighter or shorter than some so i didnt know if it woukd have feedin problems with certain kinds of ammo
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Scattered Thumbs
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« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2017, 03:55:12 pm »

Uberti rifles and carbines will work fine with any standard commercial ammo.
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Pettifogger
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« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2017, 05:59:37 pm »

For heaven's sake.  No manufacturer is going to make a firearm that cannot shoot factory ammo in that caliber.  In fact virtully EVERY factory warranty statement says it is warranted only with factory ammo.  Most CAS shooters reload so technically the shooter has voided the warranty when shooting reloads.  As far as chambers are concerned there were no SAAMI standards for the old Winchester bottleneck cases.  Whether your reloads will fit depends on the dies used.  Almost all current factory dies do not push the shoulder back far enough so a lot of people shorten them 50 or 60 thousands.
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Doug.38PR
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« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2017, 09:45:22 pm »

For heaven's sake.  No manufacturer is going to make a firearm that cannot shoot factory ammo in that caliber.  In fact virtully EVERY factory warranty statement says it is warranted only with factory ammo.  Most CAS shooters reload so technically the shooter has voided the warranty when shooting reloads.  As far as chambers are concerned there were no SAAMI standards for the old Winchester bottleneck cases.  Whether your reloads will fit depends on the dies used.  Almost all current factory dies do not push the shoulder back far enough so a lot of people shorten them 50 or 60 thousands.

I dont quite understand.  Are you saying a seating/crimping RCBS dies in 44-40, are not adequate?
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Cliff Fendley
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« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2017, 10:06:03 pm »

My RCBS dies work fine.
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« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2017, 11:29:12 pm »

I dont quite understand.  Are you saying a seating/crimping RCBS dies in 44-40, are not adequate?

Depends on the chamber tolerances and the die tolerances.  You won't know for sure until you load some ammo.  If the dies do not move the shoulder back far enough for the round to easily chamber you might have to shorten it.  I have four sets of .44-40 dies.  Only one worked on my guns without shortening.  (Hornady.)
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Cliff Fendley
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« Reply #10 on: March 21, 2017, 06:47:08 am »

Must be a Hornady problem or are you saying Hornady is the only one that worked?

I have three sets of RCBS 44-40 dies and never had any trouble with the cartridges dropping in old or new guns. I bet I've loaded for 30 different guns with those dies and never a problem chambering.

At this point if I did run into an issue I would have to blame the gun not the dies.
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wildman1
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« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2017, 07:07:19 am »

Depends on the chamber tolerances and the die tolerances.  You won't know for sure until you load some ammo.  If the dies do not move the shoulder back far enough for the round to easily chamber you might have to shorten it.  I have four sets of .44-40 dies.  Only one worked on my guns without shortening.  (Hornady.)
This is a common problem. I know several people that have had to shorten their dies.
wM1
PS Pettifogger said only ONE set worked without shortening the die.
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Coal Creek Griff
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« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2017, 10:11:16 am »

I shortened my Lee sizing die in order to assist with chambering issues.  It allows me to set the shoulder back on the cases to help the bolt close more freely (also lengthening the neck, which provides better neck tension on the bullet).

CC Griff
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Doug.38PR
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« Reply #13 on: March 21, 2017, 10:23:30 am »

Depends on the chamber tolerances and the die tolerances.  You won't know for sure until you load some ammo.  If the dies do not move the shoulder back far enough for the round to easily chamber you might have to shorten it.  I have four sets of .44-40 dies.  Only one worked on my guns without shortening.  (Hornady.)

Interesting.  If you look at Hornandy's .357 magnum cartridges, youll notice that they are actually a tad shorter than standard .357 shells.  Same thing for .45-70 hornandy shells now that i think about it
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Pettifogger
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« Reply #14 on: March 21, 2017, 12:31:17 pm »

Interesting.  If you look at Hornandy's .357 magnum cartridges, youll notice that they are actually a tad shorter than standard .357 shells.  Same thing for .45-70 hornandy shells now that i think about it

All cartridges have minimum and maximum dimensions.  It would be very unusual for new factory ammo to be at the max case length.  They are usually going to be somewhere between maximum and minimum.  Since you are a shooting a modern made Uberti with a .429 bore and in many cases a generous chamber chances are you will not have any problems.  .44-40 chamber and brass dimesions are all ove the map.  Sometimes you have to do a little experimenting to get your .44-40 reloads to function correctly.  Bullet diameter and case brand can make a big difference.  Some brass has thicker case neck walls.  Some has larger diameter rims.  Some have a pronounced bottleneck where other brands have a gentle taper.  A lot of factory .44-40 ammo uses .425 bullets to eliminate chambering problems.   The original .44-40 bullet was spec'd at .427.  Don't start overthinking this until you get the gun and try it out.  If you have problems with reloads then you can start thinking about these other things.  To make life easy I only use Winchester or Starline brass.  These have the most uniform dimensions and the thinest case neck walls.  I also have a variety of original and modern .44-40s so I have standardized on the original .427 bullet.  Some people freack out if the bullet is not at over .001 bore diameter.  For new .44-40s this is generally .429.  I have never had any accuracy problems using the .427 bullet.
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Cliff Fendley
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« Reply #15 on: March 21, 2017, 01:41:13 pm »

For CAS ranges the .427 bullets work fine. I load all my wifes smokeless 44-40 with .427 since she also shoots an older navy arms with the .427 bore. They shoot fine in the newer .429 guns too.

Now for longer ranges the larger bullets sometimes will tighten up the groups. I use .429-.430 in my black powder loads except some that are specifically loaded for original Winchesters.

I've heard some say their guns won't chamber well with a .429 or larger bullet but even our older ones with .427 bores will chamber a round with .429 bullet.
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King Medallion
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« Reply #16 on: March 21, 2017, 04:51:54 pm »

I'm lucky I guess, all 6 of my 44-40's shoot equally well with .428 cast bullets, regardless of maker. 1 Load for 6 guns, no complaints.
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Pettifogger
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« Reply #17 on: March 21, 2017, 09:51:41 pm »

For CAS ranges the .427 bullets work fine. I load all my wifes smokeless 44-40 with .427 since she also shoots an older navy arms with the .427 bore. They shoot fine in the newer .429 guns too.

Now for longer ranges the larger bullets sometimes will tighten up the groups. I use .429-.430 in my black powder loads except some that are specifically loaded for original Winchesters.

I've heard some say their guns won't chamber well with a .429 or larger bullet but even our older ones with .427 bores will chamber a round with .429 bullet.

Bore size doesn't make the big difference.  The big difference is the size of the neck area of the chamber.  Some are tighter or looser than others.  If you shoot enough .44-40s, especially if they are NOT Italian, you will find variations.  I have Merwin Hulberts, Colts, Original Winchesters, repro Winchesters from Uberti and the new "Winchester" 73, and several Lightning rifles both original and reproduction.  After years of piddle fooling around with different loads for different guns and getting the ammo mixed up on occassion I have standardized my own .44-40 loads.  (I.e., bullet size, brand of brass and dies used.)  I found that even rounds that fit into a commercial case gauge would not fit into all my guns.  I finally acquired a beat up old Colt cylinder and use that for a case gauge.  I have found that if rounds drop into the cylinder with zero interference they will fit in all my guns.  The added bonus is I can gauge six at a time with the cylinder as opposed to one at a time with a case gauge.  When shooting my Lightnings I gauge every round as Lightnings have no camming action like a lever rifle so the rounds have to drop into the chamber.

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Coffinmaker
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« Reply #18 on: March 22, 2017, 01:00:39 pm »

Providing absolutely no additional useful information ...... I resolved these issues years ago myself.  I shoot .45s.  Grin

Coffinmaker
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« Reply #19 on: March 22, 2017, 01:15:14 pm »

Providing absolutely no additional useful information ...... I resolved these issues years ago myself.  I shoot .45s.  Grin

Coffinmaker

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Coffinmaker
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« Reply #20 on: March 22, 2017, 03:41:19 pm »

I'LL HAVE YOU KNOW I resemble THAT  Roll Eyes Grin

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Cliff Fendley
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« Reply #21 on: March 22, 2017, 06:15:43 pm »

Bore size doesn't make the big difference.  The big difference is the size of the neck area of the chamber.  Some are tighter or looser than others.  If you shoot enough .44-40s, especially if they are NOT Italian, you will find variations.  I have Merwin Hulberts, Colts, Original Winchesters, repro Winchesters from Uberti and the new "Winchester" 73, and several Lightning rifles both original and reproduction.  After years of piddle fooling around with different loads for different guns and getting the ammo mixed up on occassion I have standardized my own .44-40 loads.  (I.e., bullet size, brand of brass and dies used.)  I found that even rounds that fit into a commercial case gauge would not fit into all my guns.  I finally acquired a beat up old Colt cylinder and use that for a case gauge.  I have found that if rounds drop into the cylinder with zero interference they will fit in all my guns.  The added bonus is I can gauge six at a time with the cylinder as opposed to one at a time with a case gauge.  When shooting my Lightnings I gauge every round as Lightnings have no camming action like a lever rifle so the rounds have to drop into the chamber.



I realize it's the chamber but since original bullet size specs for the 44-40 were .427 I suppose that is why some have too tight of chamber for larger bullets. I don't know if Uberti has opened the chamber dimensions or not after going with the large bore. All I know is I have never experienced the problem others claim to have chambering .429 bullets. Only on some old original guns.
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Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  Special Interests - Groups & Societies  |  The Winchester Model 1873 (Moderator: Major 2)  |  Topic: Uberti 1873 carbine .44-40 factory anmo « previous next »
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