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Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  Special Interests - Groups & Societies  |  Cosie's Corner & Feed Bag (Moderator: Delmonico)  |  Topic: POTJIEKOS, South African dutch oven cooking 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: POTJIEKOS, South African dutch oven cooking  (Read 19665 times)
Sir Charles deMouton-Black
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« on: February 17, 2015, 03:37:08 pm »


The Boer Voortrekkers were contemporaries of our Old West. And with similar conditions. Is it a wonder that they also have a tradition of Dutch oven cooking.  This came to my attention when I was browsing old books at the UVIC student book shop & saw a SA cookbook in Afrikaans.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potjiekos
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NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
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« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2015, 11:12:44 am »

I've been on-line with folks down there that still use them.
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Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

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« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2015, 12:35:20 pm »

http://funkymunky.co.za/potjierecipes.html
http://www.biltongmakers.com/biltong06c_recipes_potjies.html
http://www.taste-africa.com/product_potjie.php
http://www.potjiepots.com/food-safe-cast-iron-cooking-pots

This is an interesting topic.  Thanks for posting.  I would not have thought of the layering and separation but I have some older Dutch cauldron recipes that were all fixed in the same big pot at once so I can sort of follow where they were coming from.   This would be fun to try this spring.



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-Karl  SASS #1772 "Max Degen"
Sir Charles deMouton-Black
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« Reply #3 on: May 26, 2015, 11:57:59 am »

I just watched an English living history show called "Secrets of the Castle" It was filmed in France where a castle was being created as a research project in the actual practice of Medieval life.

One of the segments was on recreating pottery cookware. The resulting cookpot resembled one of Del's dutch ovens, or a Boer Potjie, complete with three feet and a fitted lid.
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NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”
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« Reply #4 on: May 26, 2015, 12:42:39 pm »

I just watched an English living history show called "Secrets of the Castle" It was filmed in France where a castle was being created as a research project in the actual practice of Medieval life.

One of the segments was on recreating pottery cookware. The resulting cookpot resembled one of Del's dutch ovens, or a Boer Potjie, complete with three feet and a fitted lid.

I have not seen this "Secret of the Castle" show.  I think that you are correct noticing that the Potjiekos is just a regional version of the ancient earthenware, bronze, wrought iron, or cast iron cooking cauldron.  There are a few reenactors that really run with the cooking schtick and are VERY good folks to camp with (unless you are trying to lose weight).  http://foodsoftheworld.activeboards.net/old-tinned-copper-cookware_topic1680_page2.html 

Cauldron cooking is a very different art form.  The Dutch might have kept a big cauldron simmering all day with separate bags of meat and "puddings" in it to make a whole meal.  http://cookit.e2bn.org/historycookbook/1513-dutch-pudding.html  or  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQncVs8AhfU 
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-Karl  SASS #1772 "Max Degen"
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« Reply #5 on: May 29, 2015, 09:52:30 pm »

Hey Sir Charles....  I had the opportunity to visit South Africa back in 2001 and recall a dish called pap that they used to make in huge cast iron cauldrons.  Are you familiar with it?
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Sir Charles deMouton-Black
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« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2015, 11:29:32 pm »

Half hitch; I have no connection with SA. I just read about this and noted the parallels with cast iron & dutch oven cookery with overtones of BBQ entertainment.

Karl; Thanks for the links. I have put them in my favorites. Are you the Karl posting?
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NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”
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« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2015, 07:17:52 am »

Half hitch; I have no connection with SA. I just read about this and noted the parallels with cast iron & dutch oven cookery with overtones of BBQ entertainment.

Just curious if maybe you might have run across something in the cookbook since it's a common dish in that area.  
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« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2015, 02:52:36 pm »

Half hitch; I have no connection with SA. I just read about this and noted the parallels with cast iron & dutch oven cookery with overtones of BBQ entertainment.

Karl; Thanks for the links. I have put them in my favorites. Are you the Karl posting?

Yes, because reenacting without food is well, hungry.

I had to look up "pap" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pap_%28food%29  It seems very similar to corn meal mush(s) in West Virginia.  http://allrecipes.com/Recipe/Cornmeal-Mush/ 

This has gotten me thinking about cornmeal scrapple which is basically set mush with sausage and what not in it. 
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« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2015, 09:45:23 pm »

What I saw them eating in SA was more like grits.  It was that consistency and was eaten with the fingers.  As far as I know it wasn't fried like mush would be.
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Delmonico
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« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2015, 09:00:45 am »

Grits are whole corn that has been through a process called Nixtamalization involving being processed in an alkali substance.  When cooked whole it is hominy, ground coarse it is grits and ground fine like flour it is the masa used to make corn tortillas.   

Corn ground to what ever consistency desired  and boiled like any other ground cereal is what is called mush in this country, but goes by different terms in other country's.  When it is allowed to set up, then is sliced and fried it is fried mush, however mush is often eaten like any other hot cereal such as Cream of Wheat, oatmeal, or hominy grits (the proper term)  grits can also imply any coarse ground cereal.   
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Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.
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« Reply #11 on: June 03, 2015, 09:40:17 am »

Grits are whole corn that has been through a process called Nixtamalization involving being processed in an alkali substance.  When cooked whole it is hominy, ground coarse it is grits and ground fine like flour it is the masa used to make corn tortillas.   

Corn ground to what ever consistency desired  and boiled like any other ground cereal is what is called mush in this country, but goes by different terms in other country's.  When it is allowed to set up, then is sliced and fried it is fried mush, however mush is often eaten like any other hot cereal such as Cream of Wheat, oatmeal, or hominy grits (the proper term)  grits can also imply any coarse ground cereal.   

I was referring only to the consistency when I mentioned grits.  Being from the southwest, there's only one kind of grits and that's hominy grits.  When you order grits down south, people know what you mean.  I've used masa harina when making tortillas and knew it was from corn but had no idea it was hominy.  Thanks for that tidbit, Delmonico.

Do you know what grits stands for?  Girls Raised In The South.  That, courtesy of an actress friend of mine from Charleston, S.C.   Cool
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« Reply #12 on: June 03, 2015, 01:27:30 pm »

My Grandmother usually set corn meal mush up then fried it.  Sometimes with syrup for breakfast and sometimes with salt/pepper for dinner.  I suspect that during the Depression mush and cornbread were sometimes most of what they had to eat. 

She also fixed it as a hot breakfast cereal and occasionally stiffer as a side like the pap eaten in your hand is described. 

Although fried hominy was common where I grew up I did not see grits until I joined the Army.  Then there is polenta http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polenta

At the end of the day all of these corn(maize) based foods are surprisingly similar. 

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-Karl  SASS #1772 "Max Degen"
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« Reply #13 on: June 03, 2015, 07:52:50 pm »

Nixtamalization  used for hominy, hominy grits and masa releases the Niacin found in corn so the body can use it, Pellagra is a disease caused by lack of niacin and is common in areas where the primary diet consists of corn that has not been treated with lye(Sodium hydroxide) or lime water (Calcium hydroxide) the two common alkalies used in the process. 

Lye made from wood ashes were used by the natives through much of the US and Canada, the lime water was used in the SW US and into Mexico and South America. 
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Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.
Karl
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« Reply #14 on: June 04, 2015, 12:15:49 pm »

Nixtamalization  used for hominy, hominy grits and masa releases the Niacin found in corn so the body can use it, Pellagra is a disease caused by lack of niacin and is common in areas where the primary diet consists of corn that has not been treated with lye(Sodium hydroxide) or lime water (Calcium hydroxide) the two common alkalies used in the process. 

Lye made from wood ashes were used by the natives through much of the US and Canada, the lime water was used in the SW US and into Mexico and South America. 

So basically eating corn that has not been turned into hominy can turn you into a George Romero zombie:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pellagra   Wink
I am seeing some new SASS stages here. 
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« Reply #15 on: August 14, 2015, 04:17:58 pm »

Del, that is some very interesting information on the niacin.
Regarding the South African chow, I made one of the trekker staples a while back, "vetkoek," a dough bread you fry. Wuz good, and need to make it again.
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pony express
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« Reply #16 on: August 15, 2015, 11:25:33 am »

Looks like making donuts but without the hole. Is it a yeast bread, or a quickbread?
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Sir Charles deMouton-Black
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« Reply #17 on: August 15, 2015, 12:37:44 pm »

Oregon Bill;  That looks like Bannock, which originated in Scotland but became the staple of all those living in North America, First Nations and traders, settlers, hunters, and explorers (that is almost all those living out of the few cities.)
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NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”
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« Reply #18 on: August 15, 2015, 01:25:53 pm »

It's a yeast bread. Got the recipe on a South African black powder forum. Here is the recipe, courtesy of my friend Robert:

Bill if I may steer you right, DON"T go for the baking powder route they come out quite different and make your tongue feel wooly. For me..... instant indigestion.

Try this:

1.2 kilo cake flour 1 satchet instant dried yeast
1 teaspoon salt
1 teaspoon sugar

Dissolve yeast in a half cup of warm water and stir in the sugar and let stand till frothy. Mix a pile of the flour and salt and hollow it in the middle pour in the yeast sugar mixture and start to mix the in the flour keep adding lukewarm water until you have a nice firm dough. Knead well until soft and smooth. Allow to rise covered in a warm spot.

Knead down the dough when risen to twice its size and make into fist sized balls.

Dust a wooden board with flour and flatten each ball until about a centimeter thick. Cover and allow to rise.

Whe risen, carefully lift and drop into hot oil (190 deg C) and fry until golden brown, may need to be tipped over so top and bottom are cooked to same colour. Lift vetkoek out with slotted spoon and drain onto paper towels.

The vetkoek should be slightly crisp on the outside and not oily inside. If oily inside the cooking oil was not hot enough.

Slice almost through and serve warm with favourite curry stuffed inside, or savoury mince, or real butter and apricot jam. In fact almost anything goes well with vetkoek.


The Boers used sheep fat from fat tailed sheep and rendered it down to fry vetkoek, and some families use only rendered beef fat.

They taste quite different when fried in vegetable oil. ( Nope Your cardiologist will shudder at animal fat for frying)

Enjoy!
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pony express
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« Reply #19 on: August 15, 2015, 11:17:54 pm »

Sir Charles: I thought bannock was not cooked with that much oil, the vetkoeck looks to be almost deep fried. Isn't bannock cooked with just enough oil to keep it from sticking?
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Sir Charles deMouton-Black
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« Reply #20 on: August 16, 2015, 11:28:51 am »

Sir Charles: I thought bannock was not cooked with that much oil, the vetkoeck looks to be almost deep fried. Isn't bannock cooked with just enough oil to keep it from sticking?

That's right. It seems there are many variations of pan bread.
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NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”
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