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Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  Special Interests - Groups & Societies  |  Colt SAA Clones (Moderators: RRio, Gen Lew Wallace, Hoof Hearted)  |  Topic: Uberti or Pietta SAA Clone Quality, Durability and Authenticity? 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: Uberti or Pietta SAA Clone Quality, Durability and Authenticity?  (Read 39594 times)
Cliff Fendley
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« Reply #25 on: April 29, 2013, 08:45:04 am »

The three or four Fords you can buy with the same money will outlast that Farrari.

Any current made guns will never be a true collectors item, especially in our lifetime. As long as Colt is in business and still making them one kept new in the box is worth no more than another new one. Once you start shooting that new Colt it depreciates.

I can understand the pride in ownership but the real pride in ownership to me is first or second gen SAA's. 

The difference in the cost of a new Uberti and a new Colt would be a good start toward buying an actual Colt worth cherishing.
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« Reply #26 on: April 29, 2013, 09:17:01 am »


I have had my hands on several Colt SAAs made in the last decade. Not a whole lot of difference between them and a Uberti. At least not enough to justify (for me) paying three-four times the price of a Uberti for a gun that will do the exact same thing.


well, we should compare the finish, like  the sanding in the steel, for instance, between COLT and UBERTI:

 in modern Uberties, I can see today obvious sanding paper marks, and unpleasant tone, in blued parts like Cylinder and barrel,   when compared to excellent  COLT ROYAL BLUE, whose main characteristic  today is not  the polishing, but  the sanding, or more exactly, the lack of sanding marks, giving a delicious umblemished soft touch in the finish, with a very deep deep deep BLUEING,   that in my opinion only COLT gives to their Royal Blue Finish.

the COLT case hardening,  is also years apart from UBERTI, which, by the way, has improved in the last years, but that just cant compare with COLTīs, though I prefer the old Colt casehardening to the new one.

the steel is excellent in both COLT and UBERTI, though, in my opinion, Colt gives less troubles in the bolt stop and hammer notches. I had to replace my Uberti internal parts, but never had to do it with my many times shot 3rd generation COLTS.

I wont repeat the many problems with the rifling in UBERTIS, but some shooters here were so desperate with the poor results in accuracy terms with BP and lead bullets, that they started using balls, that solved the problem and were accurate. I am talking about people competing in 25 meters bullseye historical matches. Very serious matter, no smokeless, no jacketed bullets allowed.

so you are not just bying a brand, by buying COLT. You are buying, specially today,  excellent AMERICAN CRAFTMANSHIP. And believe me, that the "MADE IN USA" logo, is still very respected in the World today.

Americans are still known the world over today  for their excellency in  manufacturing, specially, hand tools and complicated machinery.

pd: Uberti has improved greatly chamber dimensions differences in the last years, but I still dont trust them for top accuracy.
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Cliff Fendley
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« Reply #27 on: April 29, 2013, 01:15:38 pm »

Get the US finish on the Cimarron if you want the same case coloring as a Colt. I believe I read the current production Colt's are being done by Turnbull.
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« Reply #28 on: April 29, 2013, 01:33:00 pm »

The finish, the word COLT and that cute little horsey won't make a coyote or raccoon any "deader". And when the gun sits in a leather holster as long as my Ubertis do, that finish isn't going to be pretty for very long. Like I said, I use my guns in the real world, not playing cowboy. None of the Ubertis I have owned have ever failed me. I have seen ill fitting grips, tool marks and crappy finishes on a $1300 Colt too. I have a beat up 20 year old Uberti buckhorn .44 magnum that has been to hell and back. It's ugly and hasn't offered so much as a single complaint. It has eaten a few thousand full power magnum loads. I had to replace the firing pin a few years ago and the bolt spring about 18 years ago. It still locks up tight and shoots quite well.

So you can talk about how the almighty Colt is the one and only true and bestest revolver in the world, and how the lowly Uberti is junk by comparison, but I know better. With all due respect.
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MJN77
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« Reply #29 on: April 29, 2013, 02:00:37 pm »

Here's where I get my opinions from. All Ubertis. Missing from this photo is a Uberti 1866 rifle and an 1873 short rifle that I just bought. I sold my henry and 24 inch 1873.

 This is the only Colt I still own. 1905 new service in 44-40.
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petrinal
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« Reply #30 on: April 29, 2013, 02:45:13 pm »


no one said a UBERTI is junk, but I prefer one original piece like the one below.....




to a "collection" of italian replicas. (note, some replicas a are becoming collectable, but not  exactly the italian)

you are entitled to your opinion, like I am to mine. I cant give you advices on shootings coyotes, but I know what works better for me in the accuracy aspect in the shooting range, and UBERTI is not the best option, specially the older models.

the US finish is around 250 dollars more expensive in a CIMARRON, so the gun would be around 650/750/800 brand new, if I am not wrong.

you can buy a brand new COLT for 500  or 600 dollars more, or just a used one for less than 1k dollars. In my case, I go crazy for used ones, but I have to buy new ones as there are not many used ones here.

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Blair
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« Reply #31 on: April 29, 2013, 03:48:05 pm »

pretrial person,

A 5 shot DA Adams revolver is not quite the same thing as a 6 shot SA Colt revolver, now is it?
This does not mean you don't have a very nice revolver in your collection. I just means there is little to compare.
  Blair
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Blair Taylor
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« Reply #32 on: April 29, 2013, 04:49:01 pm »

pretrial person,

A 5 shot DA Adams revolver is not quite the same thing as a 6 shot SA Colt revolver, now is it?
This does not mean you don't have a very nice revolver in your collection. I just means there is little to compare.
  Blair

well, in fact, the gun is not mine. It is  a friendīs.

all my Colts are modern, third generation.

but this is the point:

I prefer  investing my money in an original piece or a collectable replica,  even if  the collection is limited to only one pieze or a couple , to spending that same amount of money  in a large collection of italian replicas, that lack any sex appeal for me.
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Blair
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« Reply #33 on: April 29, 2013, 05:27:55 pm »

petinal person,

Please provide documentation for what you are posting. (You have heard this before)
Supply information on your own firearms, or at the very least, let us all know what you have depicted is not of your own. Yours, or someone else's?
This information you offer is not specific to this thread!
Do you not understand this concept yet?
  Blair
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Blair Taylor
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« Reply #34 on: April 29, 2013, 06:50:21 pm »

Quote
no one said a UBERTI is junk,

Read it again, I said "junk by comparison"

Second, going by your logic....
Quote
I prefer  investing my money in an original piece or a collectable replica,  even if  the collection is limited to only one pieze or a couple , to spending that same amount of money  in a large collection of italian replicas

.....the twelve Ubertis in the group photo, would translate to 3-4 Colts. Yeah, much better use of the same money. Also, Colt doesn't make five of the models in that pic. You buy a Colt, you're limited to the model 1873. That's it. There was more to the history  of the "old west" era than the almighty Colt.

Quote
that lack any sex appeal for me.
Sex appeal is what I look for in a woman, not a gun. Wink
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petrinal
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« Reply #35 on: April 30, 2013, 09:51:49 am »

petinal person,

Please provide documentation for what you are posting. (You have heard this before)
Supply information on your own firearms, or at the very least, let us all know what you have depicted is not of your own. Yours, or someone else's?
This information you offer is not specific to this thread!
Do you not understand this concept yet?
  Blair

I am suppling info based on my own firearms, and  the experiences and troubles I have experienced with 3 brands:

UBERTI
COLT
TAURUS

let me add Armi San Marco, but I sold the gun long ago.





the ones above  are the personal firearms I currently own of the SAA type:

 3 COLTS, 1978 (the factory engraved one), 2007 made 38 sp, 2010 made 44/40,  1 Taurus  Gaucho 45 colt (which was a very accurate revolver, far more than the UBERTI), and one Uberti 45 colt.  

all the best


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TwoWalks Baldridge
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« Reply #36 on: May 01, 2013, 09:31:39 am »

My Grandfather bought a Colt single action when he was a young man.  That Colt is still around today.  I bought a Uberti Cattleman 2 years ago and it is still around today.

My Uberti has had more rounds shot through it in its two years of life than my Grandfather colt has had in over 100 years.

It is highly possible that a new Colt will out last a new Uberti, being used equally. But the difference in cost means I can buy 3 Uberti or Pietta's with change left over for ammo, if it is ever available again.

These Uberti's and Pietta's might not last 100 years or even 60 years, but they dang well will last as long as me.
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« Reply #37 on: May 01, 2013, 12:17:57 pm »

I am more interested in the Quality, Durability and Authenticity of the redhead on that calendar!  Tongue
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TwoWalks Baldridge
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« Reply #38 on: May 01, 2013, 04:17:09 pm »

I am more interested in the Quality, Durability and Authenticity of the redhead on that calendar!  Tongue

Single?
Likes old men?
Phone number?

Now there would be some useful information.   Grin
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petrinal
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« Reply #39 on: May 02, 2013, 10:01:31 am »

My Grandfather bought a Colt single action when he was a young man.  That Colt is still around today.  I bought a Uberti Cattleman 2 years ago and it is still around today.

My Uberti has had more rounds shot through it in its two years of life than my Grandfather colt has had in over 100 years.

It is highly possible that a new Colt will out last a new Uberti, being used equally. But the difference in cost means I can buy 3 Uberti or Pietta's with change left over for ammo, if it is ever available again.

These Uberti's and Pietta's might not last 100 years or even 60 years, but they dang well will last as long as me.

I agree, but I will probably place number 1, or 2, or 3, or 4th in the next accuracy match with my COLT.... however, with Uberti, I will place 4 or maybe 5th for sure. An excellent revolver can make the difference between winning or not and thats where you see why you paid more.  This rule does not apply to people shooting at 10 yards, or 7.

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Thomas (Tom) Horn aka James Hicks
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« Reply #40 on: May 02, 2013, 11:24:03 pm »

Well- I have read all the posts... Colts vs the Uberti's and the Piettas... something said that he gets better accuracy with a colt at 25 yards versus the Uberti which has different sized chambers... and blah blah blah.. Don't get it folks.  To each his own... I shoot Uberti's... and have shot them at 50 yard targets and they do just fine.  I see folks shooting stages with Colts at targets 7 or so feet away and they miss the target the same as others shooting something that is not a colt.  What is the point? USFA went out of business because they were not competitive or they had bad management?? The USFA was just another brand name... and the product was way overprised... maybe a 100 years from now... the USFA might be worth something? In this sport does it mean IF I don't shoot a Colt, I am not period correct?  If that is the case, then we have a lot of shooters who missed the boat... as they shoot Ruger's. Since cars were mentioned... I can recall a man who made a car called the DeLoran... that dog did not hunt either. Not all cowboys in the 19th century carried Colts... guns are guns and they are all designed to do ONE THING.... KILL ! I must have missed something in the starting of this thread or post... Personally I like the Colt... I only have one, it is a low serial number for Colts 125 Anniversary gun.  But as someone said... I can buy a lot of good looking & good shooting Uberti's for the price of two colts... and the colts will not do anything that my Uberti's won't.  Nuff said.
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« Reply #41 on: May 03, 2013, 06:16:29 am »

There will always be Ford VS Chevy or Ferrari VS Lamborghini even Pietta VS Uberti and the "Taste Great VS Less Filling" crowd..

A point I'd make, and may be lost on many ....

Colts are wonderful , they conjure an image, they are the brand, and you must pay the price....
 you have to ask yourself do I buy a current production (or collect more ) and put it/them away in the box never to be shot ... who will truly benefit . Was it a investment ? and for whom, my heirs ?
Or do I shoot them and risk $$$  Undecided
A current production 3rd. Gen  NIB, left in the box bought last year will not be more valuable , than another NIB  3 Gen. bought today nor will it be in our lifetime.

I'd choose to shoot ....posterity is fine and all that, but my guns are bought to shoot  Smiley
I care little for the profit someone may enjoy... down the road so to speak.









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petrinal
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« Reply #42 on: May 03, 2013, 10:31:10 am »

Well- I have read all the posts... Colts vs the Uberti's and the Piettas... something said that he gets better accuracy with a colt at 25 yards versus the Uberti which has different sized chambers... and blah blah blah.. Don't get it folks.  To each his own... I shoot Uberti's... and have shot them at 50 yard targets and they do just fine.  I see folks shooting stages with Colts at targets 7 or so feet away and they miss the target the same as others shooting something that is not a colt.  What is the point? USFA went out of business because they were not competitive or they had bad management?? The USFA was just another brand name... and the product was way overprised... maybe a 100 years from now... the USFA might be worth something? In this sport does it mean IF I don't shoot a Colt, I am not period correct?  If that is the case, then we have a lot of shooters who missed the boat... as they shoot Ruger's. Since cars were mentioned... I can recall a man who made a car called the DeLoran... that dog did not hunt either. Not all cowboys in the 19th century carried Colts... guns are guns and they are all designed to do ONE THING.... KILL ! I must have missed something in the starting of this thread or post... Personally I like the Colt... I only have one, it is a low serial number for Colts 125 Anniversary gun.  But as someone said... I can buy a lot of good looking & good shooting Uberti's for the price of two colts... and the colts will not do anything that my Uberti's won't.  Nuff said.

  I said 25 meters, not yards. It would be advisable to compete in such hard matches and live that experience before giving advice.

in fact, Ubertis gave many troubles using lead here to get top accuracy at 25 meters and many shooters decided to use ball, instead of bullets, in their reloadings, as that avoided leading and had great accuracy.

others chose Colts just chose other brands over Uberti, and what I say about accuracy is only with BP and lead. Ubertis are fine with smokeless.

if  someone is a bad shooter, if doesnt matter what he/she shoots...be it a SIG P210 or a Keltec....however, a very accurate revolver will  allways help you to improve as a shooter.

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Cliff Fendley
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« Reply #43 on: May 03, 2013, 08:28:55 pm »

That is the absolute total opposite of what I have experienced with Uberti revolvers. I have a couple that tend to get some leading around the forcing cone area with smokeless but not with BP.

If anything they are more accurate with black powder loads with no leading and cleaning just takes a couple swabs of moosemilk down the pipe followed by some clean patches.

My Uberti's LOVE black powder.
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« Reply #44 on: May 04, 2013, 06:29:39 am »

Quote
My Uberti's LOVE black powder.

Mine too.
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petrinal
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« Reply #45 on: May 04, 2013, 09:02:38 am »

That is the absolute total opposite of what I have experienced with Uberti revolvers. I have a couple that tend to get some leading around the forcing cone area with smokeless but not with BP.

If anything they are more accurate with black powder loads with no leading and cleaning just takes a couple swabs of moosemilk down the pipe followed by some clean patches.

My Uberti's LOVE black powder.

 If you are getting leading with smokeless, that means that you are taking the bullet to high speed, so it leads or maybe your bullet is soft, and that can happen with smokless of BP..

Bp, in reality,  is just part of the  problem, the main problem is the bullet that you must use in BP, hard cast with no shoulder, picket bullet of the period type.

the leading is not only in the forcing cone, but in all the barrel.

but as a matter of fact, I have avoided that problem, just by casting a much harder bullet, and choosing one with  very deep grooves.

what I have not changed is the innacuracy, really mediocre, and inconsistent with such loads. Sometimes good, and sometimes a disaster. Maybe later Ubertis have improved, but for years they proofed me they are not trustworthy in the accuracy aspect.

if you can share targets, shot one hand, at 25 meters, and share BP load, and bullet type,  number of shots before getting leaded the barrel, I would appreciate it.

targets at 7 yards, or 12, are not valid. Even a philippine revolver is accurate at such distances.



one day, one hand standing,  25 meters,  28 grains of 2F,  around 220 grains bullet (my memory is failing now).

URL=http://s949.photobucket.com/user/cesargijon/media/001-16.jpg.html][/URL]


same load, just any other day




allways some fliers, of course


another day


URL=http://s949.photobucket.com/user/cesargijon/media/DSCF5895_zps72b36490-1.jpg.html][/URL]

I have tried 250 grains, but the gun seems more accurate with lighter bullets at powerful BP loads.




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Cliff Fendley
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« Reply #46 on: May 04, 2013, 10:29:44 am »

If you are getting leading with smokeless, that means that you are taking the bullet to high speed, so it leads or maybe your bullet is soft, and that can happen with smokless of BP..

Bp, in reality,  is just part of the  problem, the main problem is the bullet that you must use in BP, hard cast with no shoulder, picket bullet of the period type.

the leading is not only in the forcing cone, but in all the barrel.

but as a matter of fact, I have avoided that problem, just by casting a much harder bullet, and choosing one with  very deep grooves.

what I have not changed is the innacuracy, really mediocre, and inconsistent with such loads. Sometimes good, and sometimes a disaster. Maybe later Ubertis have improved, but for years they proofed me they are not trustworthy in the accuracy aspect.

if you can share targets, shot one hand, at 25 meters, and share BP load, and bullet type,  number of shots before getting leaded the barrel, I would appreciate it.

targets at 7 yards, or 12, are not valid. Even a philippine revolver is accurate at such distances.



one day, one hand standing,  25 meters,  28 grains of 2F,  around 220 grains bullet (my memory is failing now).

URL=http://s949.photobucket.com/user/cesargijon/media/001-16.jpg.html][/URL]


same load, just any other day




allways some fliers, of course


another day


URL=http://s949.photobucket.com/user/cesargijon/media/DSCF5895_zps72b36490-1.jpg.html][/URL]

I have tried 250 grains, but the gun seems more accurate with lighter bullets at powerful BP loads.





My experience is total opposite again of what you are saying.

My smokeless loads run at only 680 and the BP loads are much higher. Also the smokeless loads lead worse with the harder bullets.

The leading is only in the forcing cone and no where else down the barrel.

I have not experienced any leading when shooting BP.





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« Reply #47 on: May 04, 2013, 12:08:20 pm »

I use to have , wish I still did, both a Uberti 7.5" 44-40 SSA and a 3rd generation 7.5" Colt, also in 44-40.
I worked more with the Italian stalion (as I fondly called it), had the barrel tweeked to center the hits, shot at 6 oclock and I finally settled on using 5744 of 17 grains with a 205 gn flat nose. Was a very accurate weapon out to the distance of our shooting arena.....25 meters.

My 3rd gen Colt needed a lot of machining on the recoil shield as the rounds would drag on the left side and lock up the cylinder.......got that fixed and it shot well..........however, I never worked with it as much as the Uberti.

The main reasons I bought the Colt was because I just wanted a Colt and because I had a Win. 92 44-40 and the two just went together in my mind.

But the Uberti got the most use. It was a tad lighter as well...........not sure why, as it had a plated brass grip frame.

Griswold
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« Reply #48 on: May 04, 2013, 04:05:32 pm »

a BP load of 28 grains is a powerful load.

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Cliff Fendley
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« Reply #49 on: May 04, 2013, 05:25:29 pm »

a BP load of 28 grains is a powerful load.



What? That is a reduced load.

My normal 45 colt and 44 wcf loads are 36 grains. I've recently started shooting Schofield brass to reduce the load to around 26 grains.

Original 45 and 44 loads were 40 grains.
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Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L  |  Special Interests - Groups & Societies  |  Colt SAA Clones (Moderators: RRio, Gen Lew Wallace, Hoof Hearted)  |  Topic: Uberti or Pietta SAA Clone Quality, Durability and Authenticity? « previous next »
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