Testing Natural Walnut Dye

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

Howdy all

    I've been fooling around with walnut dye , to see what works best for me, I've found that leaving my leather work submerged for a longer time than just 24 hours at room temp. or outside temp. at least in warmer weather, but not in the sun,  that I get my best results, I just did a test on three pieces of leather two were 4 to 5 ounce and one 8/9 ounce, the first one I left submerged for 5 days, and the second and third for 1 day, these pictures show the results, 002 shows the piece of leather that was submerged for 5 days, and has dried fully, and this is all the color I was able to get out of it. 004 shows all three pieces, the two on the left were soaked for 1 day and conditioned with Lexol and one coat of EVOO, I wasn't happy with the color, or depth of color.The one on the right (the one I soaked for 5 days ) after conditioning with Lexol, and putting one coat of EVOO, then putting in the sun until I got the darkness I wanted , came out beautiful, it's a dark walnut brown in color, and the depth is nice and deep, the tone and shade was just what I was after, and it looks a lot better in person.
     I use plastic containers , to fit the size of my leather pieces that I'm dyeing, and I keep the lid on so it will sweat, everyday I'll stir it up a bit and move the leather piece around, this helps to get a more even dye job.
   So I wanted to share this with you, the dye I made this time, was from fresh green black walnuts right off the tree, with the green skin still on , and I just filled up one leg of a ladys stocking and tied it off , I didn't crush the shells , I just put them in a big pot , and cooked it down for three days , after bringing the liquid to a boil, I reduced the heat and simmered them on a low flame for about three hours with the lid on, each day for three days , letting them cool in between, the extra day of cooking might have made the difference, but leaving the leather submerged for five days too also made a difference, this combination of methods  works well. So this is the way I'm going to do the dye from now on.  one thing , don't let the liquid cook dry, make sure you have enough water in the pot to cover the nuts, and keep the lid on while cooking or your water will evaporate.
    If you're going to make enough dye to last you for a while, you can add a 1/8 cup of rubbing alcohol to a quart of liquid dye , so that it won't go bad on you, or you can freeze it also , if you have room in your freezer you can also freeze the GREEN BLACK WALNUTS, I have some in the freezer right now and I keep adding to them every day, for as long as they keep falling off the tree. Anything liquid left over after dyeing can be poured back in its plastic container, I use what ever is handy on the plactic containers, I'm useing cat litter containers now, because they're large and hold a lot more liquid dye.


                                                              Thanks for stopping by


                                                                   tEN wOLVES 

[Johnny Dingus]

tEN W,

Thanks for the test results....

5 days soaking is kinda hard on some of us newer leather workers.... You know us younguns that want it now.

Going to give this a try as soon as I get some walnuts.

Am currently trying USMC black mixed with evoo to get my new brown.

You know when you see Chucks brown and you just fall in love with it you start trying everything to get that perfect Brown.



Johnny Dingus

[Dalton Masterson]

Hey 10W, those are green as in picked off the tree today type of walnuts, right? With the big ugly green skin? I have been scoutin out some trees here in town, and there are a bunch of them ready to come off if now is the time. Also, what does this concoction smelll like when cooking? Do I need to do it outside? Thanks. DM

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[Marshal Will Wingam]

I did mine inside, Dalton. It didn't smell too bad but I'd bring it to a boil then take it outside to cool. Did that every day for 3 or 4 days. Before straining it off.

Yesterday I dunked a test holster (the one I said might go to the kid next door) in the batrch I made, flesh side up. This morning I pulled it out and turned it over. I used an aluminum roasting pan and it had ribs in the bottom. Where the leather rested on those, it left light areas. Next time I'll start with the finished side up. Tonight I took it out and it's drying in the shed now. It'll be interesting to see what the results are.

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

Howdy Pards

       Dalton , I used GREEN BLACK WALNUTS, NOT CRUSHED, I pick them up after they fall off my neighbors tree, I don't do anything to them , not even washing them, I just put them in a ladys stocking tied it off and then in the pot with water, covering the walnuts by a couple inches with water , and cooked at a very low simmer , after reducing from a boil, keep the lid on or your liquid will evaporate, it doesn't stink like Vinegaroon does , and is totally safe to cook inside, in fact my sister inlaw wanted to know what smelled so good, so being me I asked her if she would like a bowl.

      Johnny I know where your coming from , when I was younger i didn't have patients for nothing, this is one of those things you do ahead of time, and if you make enough , it will last you a long time, when I'm done I just pour it back in its container, and store it away for next time.

                                                                thanks for asking 

                                                                   tEN wOLVES 

[Dalton Masterson]

Ok, next question(s),  I assume you dye it first, then do your tooling? I have a coffee can full of them right now, how much do you think I will get out of them? How much are you guys making at a time? Thanks.

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

 Dalton the first batch I made was 8 gal., and I still use this , the batch i made this time is about 3 gal., this batch is stronger than the first, and I think it's because I used the GREEN BLACK WALNUT, this time, the color I got was because I think there was more dye pigment in the leather, than the two pieces I soaked for just 24 hours.
 
  I do my tooling first, in fact I finish my work all together including the sewing, and some burnishing, final burnishing and finishing I do later

                                 

                                                             tEN wOLVES 

[Ace Lungger]

 :)TW,
 I do think you are right about the color of the leather before you put it in the dye. The 2 peices I have had soaking were real light to start with. I am useing a very small set up to do mine, I have a hot plate that is most likely about shot, but it still works!
I am using a 2 gallon size old pressure cooker that I took the seal off, so it would not build up pressure and put the green walnuts in the hose allmost fills the pot up ad 2 litre's of water which fills it up to the top and turn it on high. It takes it about 2 hrs to come to a boil and then I let it boil for about 30 mins. and then i turn off the hot plate and let set untill that evening and then take it off, i do the next for 3 days except I add a little water every day to make up for what has boiled away, is that about the right way?

Later
ACE

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Dalton, I did all my tooling first. I'll assemble it next. I didn't make enough to submerge a completed holster in it. I barely had enough to cover it laid out flat. Obviously I didn't make enough and before I do another rig, I'll need to brew up a new batch. I won't be putting steel wool in it next time so I can have that nice warm walnut color. To overcome the greying, I dumped a quarter cup of Fiebings russet dye in it. That brought the warmth back into it, but it sure isn't the color I was looking for. It actually may have ended up a little dark but I'll know later today.

For the next batch, I'll use a large kettle so I have a couple gallons. I guess I'll be hitting all the yeard sales this weekend. This is all a learning curve for me so I'm getting to find out these things the hard way. The unassembled holster is now inside drying. I expect later today to be able to see what the color actually is. I'll complete it but I expect to do a whole lot different next time. The walnuts are almost ready so I'll be gathering the hulls as soon as possible. BTW, I used the hulls that were left over after they split and the walnuts had fallen out. It's much easier than trying to get them off the nuts when they're still developing. You get to eat the nuts that way, too.

My wife wants the use of the back of the fridge. This could get complicated.

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

:)TW,
 I do think you are right about the color of the leather before you put it in the dye. The 2 peices I have had soaking were real light to start with. I am useing a very small set up to do mine, I have a hot plate that is most likely about shot, but it still works!
I am using a 2 gallon size old pressure cooker that I took the seal off, so it would not build up pressure and put the green walnuts in the hose allmost fills the pot up ad 2 litre's of water which fills it up to the top and turn it on high. It takes it about 2 hrs to come to a boil and then I let it boil for about 30 mins. and then i turn off the hot plate and let set untill that evening and then take it off, i do the next for 3 days except I add a little water every day to make up for what has boiled away, is that about the right way?

Later
ACE

Howdy Ace

     You have the right idea, it doesn't matter what size pot you have , but the biger ones will just give you more dye in the same time of cooking, the one I use is either an 18 or 20 QT. pot , it's the blue porcelain, finished, the type I use for camping.
     The color pigment in the GREEN black walnuts, seems to make a stronger dye, just cooking them right off the tree seems to do the job, also Ace I think cooking them more than two days also helps to make it stronger too, you will notice the liquid getting thicker each day of cooking, so bring to a boil and then turn the fire down to a low simmer , so that it just bubbles, this is what CB does, but were adding one more day of cooking.
   
     Dalton there wouldn't be anything wrong with doing your tooling and stamping after you did your dye, I know WG talks about doing his this way , but you would have to be careful with your caseing , you would want to do it at the right moment, so that the leather doesn't dry out to much or is too wet, but you've done this enough to know when it's right , I just thought I put that in for others that might not.


  Marshal Will, I was going to say keep the fresh side down, but I see you found this out, what ever you are going to use to dye in ( or soak in ) use something that has smooth surfaces, or the leather will be marked by any high spots , MW I found this out my ownself , a few months ago when I started doing this. if it wasn't for screw ups we wouldn't know when we did things right.

   If you pards want to make the color darker, AFTER YOU HAVE DYED YOR LEATHER , AND LET DRY, and I do mean DRY, you can give the leather a baking soda/water bath, but you will want to be careful as to how much baking soda you use to the water , and don't leave it in too long, like CB SAYS not more than a minute, for a light bath use 1/4 cup of baking soda to a QT. of water, if you want it stronger go to a 1/2 to 3/4 cup of baking soda to water, but be CAREFUL if you leave it in too long it will turn your leather that was light brown to black, don't ask me how I know this just take my word, it is still a nice way to give it a little more color and it looks nice when done right and it will turn your leather darker, when you have the leather in the slurry of BS/Water just work the water and BS all over and around the leather to make sure everything has been covered , the dark brown piece of test leather that I did, didn't need the baking soda, just Lexol and one coat of EVOO.


                                                  tEN wOLVES

[Ace Lungger]

 :)Howdy TW,
 I will agree with you 100% on everything you stated! I have been cooking one batch for 4 days now, I do have to add a little water every day because of the evaporation. Since I have nothing to loose, I am going to cook this batch 7 days, just to see what I get!! I have a bigger pot, but I don't have a lid for it! But what I am using works good for me, because me and the wife are Pepsi holics, we drink 8 -2litres a week, and that is what this pot cooks up and that is what I store my dyes in!
  I am going to make a new batch of Vingagroon using white viniger, just to see if there is a diff. and the white is one fourth the price as the cider viniger! I think MW uses the white type with good luck!

Later
ACE

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Since I have nothing to loose, I am going to cook this batch 7 days, just to see what I get!! I have a bigger pot, but I don't have a lid for it! But what I am using works good for me, because me and the wife are Pepsi holics, we drink 8 -2litres a week, and that is what this pot cooks up and that is what I store my dyes in!

Lessee, cookin' pepsi and drinkin yer dye.... I see a rather large investment in teeth whitener strips. LOL, just funnin'.

I mentioned to my wife about looking for a large pot at a yard sale. She suggested I use a pot we already have. One of those big suckers that have a burner to stand on for cooking turkeys in oil. We've had it for a few years and never used it. Good idea, it saves me looking all over for a pot. Not only that, if I ever do cook a turkey, it'll be all dark meat. 

Yeah, I did use white vinegar. I don't think there's any difference in how it works and there's always a gallon or two of it on hand around here. It's good for cleaning things.

[Ace Lungger]

 :)MW,
That Pepsi and a shot of Walnut Dye aint half bad even better with a shot of Crown
I had though you posted that, and there is a lot of diff. in price So next tome i go to Wal Mart, I am going to get ne about 4 gallons.

You all have a good weekend!
ACE

[santee]

You know when you see Chucks brown and you just fall in love with it you start trying everything to get that perfect Brown.

Man, that's where I am. Will Ghormley's brown is doing it for me too. TeN Wolves, I think you got it!!

[Marshal Will Wingam]

OK, I finished the test holster. The color is really nice. It was too grey but the russet I added really warmed it up again. I'll be making a new batch without the steel wool in it. The design is a loose copy of a holster in Packing Iron. I had to make two new stamps to do the fern pattern. I'll be making one of these (without the errors) for my next rig. Here's a pic. Notice the Will G. floral stamp. That stamp is the same as the one that was used on the original.

[Ace Lungger]

Howdy MW,
AWESOME look, rght out of the book!! I like the color but I like the design better!!! Never thought of using the FJ stamps in that manor but with the roll over stamping around the bucket realy sets it off from the norm
 It looks period correct, as much as I would love to learn to carve, and i am going to someday, the average cowboy didn't where a super flloral carve Holster! PLEASE no one get offended, because I love to see the art work that is done to a carve holster and respect the time and effort it took to do that and I hope to be there some day, but my comment was that MW new holster hear looks lihe a cowboy holster that would be worn.
Super great job MW
Thanks For Sharing!
ACE

[santee]

Errors? What errors? I don't need see no stinking errors!

[cowboywc]

MW
That's a good lookin holster
WC

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Thanks, pards. There are a few changes I'll make to the shape on the next one.

Wayne, that uses those two stamps I was telling you about where I had to make a right and a left.

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

Howdy Marshal Will

        Your holster came out beautiful, thats what's nice about the walnut dye , there are so many colors and tones you can come up with , and you can use other dyes to get different looks just by adding to the color you allready have. I really like your holster, great design, and the tooling you used and design of pattern really makes everything stand out. Well done Will.


                                                               tEN wOLVES